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NSW Underhanded Trick by HWP

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' started by Bandit01, Mar 14, 2013.

  1. Seems the Old Pacific Highway trick is being used on MacquariePass.
    Be careful and spread the word far and wide.

    I received this email earlier today and you need to make sure all riders are aware of the underhanded type approach highway patrol are apparently using to trick riders into breaking the law.

    In order to let you know who I am, I have corresponded with you once before about an incident involving myself and my brother being booked at
    AlbionPark, NSW. We fought that charge and it was dismissed before court, I sent you the details on the 10th April last year for your records. On Sunday the 10th of March, myself and 3 others rode out on the Illawarra h'way to MacquariePass. As we approached the first corner at the bottom of the Pass , a blue/grey Prado, rego BM90JD was observed to pull out from the left of the roadside and proceed slowly up the Pass in front of us. Motorcyclists being what they are , we overtook as soon as we had a chance. Several others that were not riding with us , did the same thing a little further up the pass and eventually caught up with us. After crossing the railway bridge after the Tourist road turnof , we were ALL pulled over in an open area on the left , that I thought was a booze bus location. It contained a van, and two highway patrol cars. We were asked to produce licences, rego numbers were written down , and we were then informed that we would ALL(11 riders) be booked for "not keep left of dividing line" a $298 fine and loss of 3 points offence. We were informed that we had been filmed by a covert police vehicle (the officer's words, not mine), which had also pulled into the open area. Everyone received their infringement notice, I was told that "we wont go on with any speed offence, but we are experienced in estimating speed" , and that I should slow down in future. Point taken by me, I was then released to go about my business. The Prado had dark tinted windows, and a Go-Pro style camera pointing forward thru the windscreen from a mount either on the dash or the windscreen itself. Two officers in plain clothes manned the vehicle, one armed with a clip-board on which he had written rego numbers and a brief description of the bike and rider. It was obviously targeting motorcycles on the Pass, and was observed to be there all day. I realise that entrapment is not recognised in law in this country, but to all intents and purposes that is what is going on here. Like it or not I did commit an offence and am resigned to paying the penalty, but it does leave a sour taste in my mouth that they resort to this to revenue raise - a marked car at the bottom of the Pass would have had the same effect of making riders(and drivers) obey the law , as inducing them to break it then fining them afterwards. Several hours later at the end of the days ride, we went back down the Pass on the way home and saw the Prado back down the same place again. We rode towards AlbionPark for 5 minutes, not seeing any other motorcycles, but did see approx 12 cars heading towards the Pass. We then stopped and turned around and went back, and sure enough the Prado was still there , obviously NOT baiting car drivers. Once again as we approached, it pulled out in front of us and proceeded up the Pass. Alas, we decided not to follow, and they had a wasted trip up as we slowed and let them go out of sight , turned around at the bottom and went home. Possibly a warning to any riders that you come across, that these new tactics are in use, may help others not to receive similar fines in the future.
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  2. That's f*cking disgusting.
  3. No it's not. Mac pass has a double-unbroken line all the way up,and you overtake anyone at your own risk......
  4. Just out of interest what speed was it doing up the pass? The limit on straights? Averaging 10km/h under? Excessively under the limit?

    Does anyone know if there's an avenue of complaint to the police if say they're doing 20-30 up the straights?

    Also, What happens if you turned up tourist road?
  5. Everything about entrapment is disgusting. I don't care who they are or what they're doing, but waiting for a specific type of vehicle to approach, pulling out in front of them and then purposely displaying provocative behavior with the knowledge that the majority of people will be try and avoid you, then booking them for it is total bullshit.

    It's exactly the same as the highway patrol who tear up the freeway and tailgate inches away from P platers and other cars, scaring less experienced drivers into speeding up to get away from them and then booking them. I have know 5 people personally that this has happened to.

    Like I've mentioned elsewhere, my brother in law has been in the force over 20 years and even he thinks all this is complete bullshit. Police are there to protect and serve. That does not include the equivalent of going up to people, pushing them around, spitting at their feet and then knocking them out when they retaliate thinking this is just some prick out to start shit with people, not realising it's a cop.
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  6. EVERY rider, especially on the weekend when we are invaded by out-of-town riders, breaks the law on Macquarie Pass. I drive this road twice a week for work and several other days of the week for recreation. I have NEVER seen any Police behaviour even vaguely like that described, in fact I rarely see Police on the road in ANY sort of vehicle.
  7. Oh please...I forgot you're an angel.

    Going by your history, you miss plenty of other road users...

    Mobile tax collectors give me the shits.
  8. Pretty sketchy. Would hate to see the cops response if a rider kills themselves trying to overtake it.
  9. This is the advantage of living above the pass, to ride up it, i 1st get to ride down and take note of any police or bad conditions
  10. Guess because you havent seen them then they are never there then hey?
  11. Usually police on the pass, book above or below the pass in the straighter areas, trying to get someone after turning and catching them on it is useless in traffic.

    I would guess if you turned off down tourist rd which i do often to go home, that they would send a fine in the mail. It's a good heads up though, as they would get me if i didn't know
  12. There is a Class action law suit that was reported by the Motorcycle Council being undertaken after that similar incident to this on The Old Rd a couple of months back.Its good this info gets out to the riding public.Its hard to believe anyone would overtake on a solid line if stuck behind a really slow vehicle on one of these type roads .Just think about how much paint thats been wasted trying to protect them.And the horror of anyone not local being there,maybe a really big sign warning off anyone not local.
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  13. I'm not a fan of solid centre lines in general. Sure you can have a solid line at a known high crash site or where there is a particular reason why overtaking should be prohibited, but there is no need for solid lines for long distances for no particular reason.

    Make it broken centre lines and leave it up to driver discretion about when it is ok to overtake. If you can't see it to be clear and can't make it back on to your side of the road assuming there is a vehicle about to emerge from behind the next bend, then just don't overtake. You don't need a broken or unbroken line to tell you what to do.
  14. Unfortunately there is a high fatality rate on Mac Pass and the majority of these involve motorcycles. I hear the sirens go past my house frequently on weekends and feel the pain that someone is now suffering. Having said that the lines are from top to bottom and limited places where you can legally overtake and there are certainly a lot of drivers on the road lacking in skills and I think that there are other ways to protect bike riders without resorting to entrapment.
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  15. i wonder in court, If the unmarked car signalled or waved you by, could you argue that you were following directions of a police officer trained in traffic management. And you did not wish to disobey a direct command from police
  16. Sounds like a fair cop to me.
  17. Mate, you have a lot more faith in the average Australian road user than I do.
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  18. Paul,

    I was waiting to see your response on this knowing that you are local and travel the road frequently. I don't think anyone is arguing that overtaking on unbroken lines is against the law or that bike riders shouldn't be booked for breaking the law; the issue is with the underhanded manner in which the Police seek to trap bike riders. I only wish the Police would also check the road condition when they drive the Pass. In November last year my son hit a patch of sand mid corner writing off his $12K GSX-R750. It wasn't speed or doing anything illegal that caused the accident, rather the sand. I'm sure most riders would have also dropped their bike if it had hit the sand, even at a speed well below the posted limit.

    We need to organize a decent ride around that area as it has some great motorcycling roads. Are you able to suggest a decent 200-300k ride route? Also how's the VFR going?

  19. Macquarie Pass USED to have a broken centreline, but a couple of years ago the 60kph speed limit was strengthened by nearly all its length being made double unbroken line. There may or may not be any correlation between the two matters, but there hasn't been a fatality accident inside that double-line zone since. (There have been many accidents, however, my own brother's included. While his was caused by a truck being over the centreline, resulting in him being hit head-on, the majority have been as a result of excessive speed for the conditions, diesel spills and rider over-ambition.)
    And in terms of riders actually being killed on the Pass, strictly speaking there have only been two in the actual Pass precinct. One was in the middle of the Pass, a fair while ago, and the other was on the entrance to the first hairpin going up, where a guy on a Ducati, who was, even by the testimony of his mates 'riding like an idiot', came upon some cars slowly trying to negotiate the hairpin, over-braked and lost control of the bike, and came off it, and was actually killed as he plumetted down the cliff into the bush below.
    Just a couple of years ago a lady riding a sidecar without a passenger in the chair lost control of the outfit, and took out another bike coming up at the railway overpass. She was killed and the other rider is still suffering from his multiple injuries today. Just a year or so ago a guy piled into the back of a car pulling into a farm just east of the Pie Shop. Again, we don't class that part of the road as strictly being part of Macquarie Pass. For most of us the Pass ends at the overtaking lane out of the last left-hand hairpin......
    It IS a dangerous road, but many other straighter, more innocuous roads, have a higher road toll.....
  20. Colin, I have an $18 million Police Station at the end of my street, and I drive/ride past it dozens of times a week, sometimes three or four times a day, and at all hours of the day and night. I have never, in its precincts, or parked in the nearby streets, seen a car even closely matching the description given in this unsubstantiated and anonymous report. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, and I'm not saying something LIKE what's described could have happened. But I've been on Netrider and other motorcycling forums long enough to smell a rat when these sorts of anti-police stories surface. Generally it's classic dog-whistle stuff, and it gets the response it seeks.

    As to your son's incident, please see what I've posted above, I agree that the road has its hazards. But as I noted, and as waedwe also commented, Police practice on the Pass is to follow an offending vehicle to a place where it's safe to pull over and issue a ticket, or to note and record behaviour and issue a ticket in the mail. They could, if they wanted to, patrol the Pass with vehicles displaying lights and sirens, and they would STILL be able to detect enough people breaking the law in any number of ways to make it worth their while; they have no need to conduct such an exercise as described. Remember the Pass has a 60kph speed limit; even little old ladies in Corollas do more than that. They could book 90% of the people on the road, every day of the week, for speeding, if they wanted to.
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