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Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' at netrider.net.au started by Slattery, Dec 10, 2008.
Now people around here will know I am not tolerant of cops behaving like they are above the law, but this is capital â€œSâ€ Stupid.
The Cop had stopped the pursuit the dead guy had already been pulled up once before that day and given an infringement for riding unlicensed and then the fiancÃ© of the dead guy says
"I don't know how I feel now it's all over. He (Hughes) can go home every day to his partner ... but I can't do that. I've lost so much."
Well the cop didnâ€™t make your F$%kwit fiancÃ© run when he put the lights on, The Cop didnâ€™t make him ride outside of his ability.
Reading the article you would have expected the cop clipped the dead guy or something, but he just put up chase.
It's not about whether the guy crashed and died. It's about a cop starting a chase in a 20 kn/hr zone - and travelling at speed through what's virtually a pedestrian precinct. It's not about endangering the idiot he's chasing - it's about endangering anyone else in the area.
The rider was a dick. The cop charging hard in that area was also a dick - even if he had the sense to call the chase off.
When I read the story I thought it was crazy that the officer could be prosecuted given they called off the chase prior to the accident.
But after seeing the video footage of the incident through the pedestrian crossing, it was just plain stupidity of the cop. He KNEW who the guy was as he had pulled him up before - why not pay him a visit about the incident rather than giving chance through a built up area like that.
So IMO the cop did something wrong and should be punished accordingly but his dangerous driving and the crash are two very different incidents...
my 2c worth :?
If it wasn't already a viable option before it will be now - if you decide to run from the cops, make sure you make it REALLY dangerous. The more dangerous the better. That way they will have to give up much more quickly.
As for the girlfriend, maybe this is your chance to hook up with someone with half a brain.
You really are a piece of work FL :roll:
People make fcuked decisions all of the time. I bet you have made them too.
Labeling the bloke a fcukwit because he ran and got himself dead is just too much.
Disrespectful isn't a strong enough word.
I'm with you FL. My fcuked decisions have NEVER had ANYTHING to do with running from the cops or being a lawless asshole.
Not everyone is perfect though You and I are obviously excluded
Sorry Vic, but when the fiancÃ© is talking as if the cop had killed the guy, My sympathy goes out the window a little. The guys death was almost entirely independent of the cops actions.
Now as for the Video The taxi in the foreground wasnâ€™t travelling that much slower, nor was the bus he passed in the background, the crossing was clear to both sides as far as the camera shot could see as he approached the crossing.
Was it safe, Probably not entirely But as Vic sais we all make questionable decisions every now and then.
Note also, had he not followed because the rider was waring a helmet he could claim â€œNo Officer it wasnâ€™t meâ€
And these will be points that get raised in the appeal. It looks like this will go to the supreme court.
Recently I went on a trip to Cooma, between Mt. Hotham and Jindabyne, a VFR800 passed and he made a gesture of a siren. Everyone that saw it slowed down to the speed limit and 5 minutes later, a copper in a 4WD came tearing round a corner skipping across the bitumen to our left at the apex, ending up over a metre past the double lines and into our lane, almost taking out 3 riders of our group. The cops mustn't have been too worried, because there were 3 seperate rider groups that remarked about them driving well past the vehicles abilities at the pub that night.
So the cop books him earlier, he knows where the bloke lives yet he still feels a chase is warranted.
All chases should be outlawed in my opinion.
2 wrongs don't make a right.
How many times have you read that a cop broke every road law ever written just to pull over someone lane splitting??
Chases are harder and harder to justify.
Even if the bloke was a complete dickhead, does he deserve to die for his stupidity?
Riding unlicenced, speeding, creating the chase in the first place... Would you say the same statement if he killed someone else during the chase (the rider that is)
Its not that much of a stupid decision really, not a brain explosion as to something that would have been thought about... He was pulled over 2 hours prior, thats the first decision point. "Gee maybe I should go home" then the RIDER made the second decision to ignor the cop, road rules and public safety for a second time... No one deserves to die, but if it protects someone elses safety then whats the difference? what if the bike rider hit the pedestrians, would he have cared at all?
Oh and unlicenced in SA means no 3rd party body insurance either.
No. I donâ€™t say he deserved to die at all, but I also say that quoting his fiancÃ© dribbling on about the light sentence is insulting as the cop pretty much had nothing to do with the death
And you made a formal written complaint about these idiots when?
Believe it or not Vicpol do chase up most complaints, and if enough are registered action is (often) taken.
I see it another way. I WANT the cops to chase because if they don't then the law isn't being upheld. And if they don't chase repeat, unlicenced riders/drivers who have clearly demonstrated that they don't give even half a fck about the law, who's to say their very next act of breaking the law maybe 30 seconds later isn't going to kill someone just going about their business.
Yeah, 'cos there's nothing safer to the community than a desperate individual on the run attempting to evade lit-up police through crowded streets as opposed to following them discretely from a safe distance and apprehending them when they pull up to stop at their destination.
Unfortunately if the offender is speeding then the police would have to speed too, and if they are following discretely, I take it you mean that there are no lights on. If they have no lights on and are speeding and a car changes lanes or pulls out in front of them then they will be hung for the consequences of that too. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.
IMO, unlicenced and/or unregistered people tend to drive in a manner that DOESN'T draw undue attention to themselves anyway. Quite unlikely that the speeder would be doing anything dramatic. If they're speeding so fast that it becomes dangerous, then the chase would be called off anyway, right?
As for the lights and sirens making a difference to the safety of other road users, I've witnessed plenty of drivers completely oblivious to ambulances and firetrucks behind them, lights on, sirens on, etc, etc. If anything I would argue that having the lights and sirens on has a tendency to make other drivers behave erratically. Far better for the police procedure to allow them to follow discretely IMO.
If the speeds are dangerous, being lit up and sounding off won't make one whit of difference. If you're travelling in the same direction as a vehicle with sirens on at highway speeds it can be quite difficult to hear them until they're right on top of you.
Good points. I have to agree with you there. They don't have to be moving and there is an issue. I have a mate who is a police officer. He was in a stationary police car with the lights on and had a car run up his rear end and stuff him over.
My point was more aimed a the point that if they were involved in a collision then the finger would first be pointed at the lack of lights and siren. But I realise where you are coming from now. I was assuming that the offender had initially been aware of the police presence and took off. Hence the speed, etc.