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Substitute oil for Scottoiler

Discussion in 'Technical and Troubleshooting Torque' started by Mr Messy, Jun 15, 2010.

  1. Hi all.
    Question for my fellow and ex scottoiler owners.
    Ran through quite a bit of the oil in some big rides, and at nearly $20 for a half litre, ive decided i might check alternatives.

    Curious if anyone substitutes the original in your scottoiler?

    A google search suggest chainsaw bar oil, but warns that while it lubes just as well it doesnt fling quite as much, so it can build up and doesnt clean the chain as much by taking the dirt with it. Is a possible... but curious to know if any of you use something other then the original.

    Ta :angel:.
  2. kettenmax

    first! *WIN*
  3. NO WAIT,
    i thought that thing cleaned and lubed...looks like it just cleans.. I'M AN IDIOT!
    sorry Mr. Messy
  5. Hmm... its hardly anything like a scottoiler though mate :p.
    Scottoiler rocks... its just a question of what to fill it with since both cost and the fact no aussie supplier of scottoil wants to talk to me.
  6. You might want to turn your Scottoiler down. Mine has used maybe 300ml in 18500km, and is set such that the back of the bike is quite oily most of the time (keeps corrosion at bay and reduces attractiveness to theives :grin:), so I wouldn't regard $20 for 500ml as being a big outlay.

    That said, when I finish the 500ml bottle it came with, I'm going to try some carefully filtered used sump oil or, possibly, a drop of the hydraulic oil that I have sitting around in a big drum. I'd expect to have to change the flow setting on the oiler to suit.

    Based on my past experience with chain drive bikes (had a bit of a break riding shafties), IMHO the nature of the lube is less important than the fact that it's there at all, so I feel quite confident about experimenting a bit.

    It's not that I think the right stuff is expensive (see above), it's just that I'm sufficiently lazy and disorganised, and getting a new bottle is sufficiently inconvenient, that I can be guaranteed not to have any available when I need it. Hence considering alternatives.
  7. oooh i see, well that is an interesting question.
    perhaps similar devices would use a lube of the same consistancy though.
    happy hunting
  8. this is from th Pro-Oiler FAQ>"

    FAQ r1.6


    1. What oil should I use in the PRO-OILER?

    The short answer is use any clean motor oil

    Mineral, semi-synthetic, fully synthetic... it doesn't really matter - though synthetic oil's better viscosity index is a marginal advantage

    We have carried out extensive tests with various different classes of oils, and all have their pro's and con's.

    Motor oil's cocktail of special additives have little to do with exposed chain lubrication. However, it does have a mix of charactristics which make it the best compromise for use in the pumped PRO-OILER.

    The PRO-OILER is a total-loss lubrication system - the old dirty oil eventually flings off as it's replaced by new oil ("self-regeneration").

    If the chain is washed in oil (as with imprecise gravity-feed or manual systems), then the choice of oil is not so critical.

    One of the PRO-OILER's trump cards is that it can run very lean settings. But this does mean that the small quantity of oil that does get used must do the whole job.

    The oil has to have the following qualities

    · Good coverage ("wetting power")

    - Important because the oil has to get to all parts of the chain without using excessively rich settings (eg. the outside of the side-plates for corrosion protection)

    - Good wetting power = low consumption = low fling-off

    · Good lubrification qualities

    - Some oils may have a string of attractive features, but have poor lubrication... eg. silicone-based chain oils

    · 100% Guaranteed compatibility with NBR seals (pump's seals and chain's o-rings)

    Motor oil

    + Great wetting power (spreads well on the chain = good hydro-capillary characteristics)

    + Self-regenerating (not sticky, so dirt and dirty oil remains do not stick to the chain)

    + Produces the lowest consumption

    + Guaranteed compatibility with NBR seals in the pump and chain's o-rings

    - Relatively low adhesion means

    - it flings off easily. However,

    this also keeps the chain clean

    you need less oil = lower consumption = less fling off than thick sticky oil

    - delivery has to be turned up higher and more quickly when the roads are wet (ie. it is not as resistant to the washing action as other more adhesive oils)

    Gearbox oil

    Pro's and con's broadly similar to motor oil

    + EP (Extreme Pressure) charateristics, so theoretically better protection at the bushing-roller contact area

    - Wetting power not quite as as good as motor oil, so needs a richer setting

    Chainsaw bar oil

    + Adhesive (but see below)

    + Good performance in the wet, as it doesn't wash off as easily as motor oil. The delivery does not need to be turned up as high or as promptly as with motor oil

    + Inexpensive

    - Wetting power is not as good as motor oil, so richer settings required = higher consumption = more fling off

    - Picks up dirt due to adhesiveness. Self-regenerating, but only at richer settings

    - Not guaranteed compatible with NBR seals and o-rings because this compatibility is not part of the design brief for a chainsaw bar oil! We have encountered oils which have attacked the seals.

    - Not always easy to find the right type of oil (mineral, not bio-degradable which can rot in the lines and pump)

    Specialized industrial chain oils

    + Great lubrication qualities

    + Self-regenerating

    + Hydro-capillary qualities (penetrates quickly)

    + Guaranteed compatible with NBR seals in the pump and chain's o-rings

    - Relatively low adhesion means

    - it flings off easily. However, this also keeps the chain clean

    - delivery has to be turned up higher and more quickly when the roads are wet (ie. it is not as resistant to the washing action as other more adhesive oils)

    - Expensive... up to Eur 30 per litre!

    Bottom Line:

    Motor oil is by happy coincidence the oil type that delivers the lowest consumption, and least fling-off.

    Want proof? During initial testing and calibration, PRO-OILER used Stihl chainsaw bar oil, and the values of the tables were matched to this oil. Later, when testing motor oils, the consumption dropped by close to 20%. In fact, all the richer tables became completely redundant, and have now been dropped!

    2. Do I need to use thinner oil in winter, like in a gravity feed system


    The PRO-OILER's delivery is not affected by temperature.

    It's been road-tested down to -10C and performed well without even needing changed settings.

    3. Can I use penetrating oil like WD40?

    Unfortunately, no.

    Those qualities that make penetrating oils like WD40 so good at their job, also mean the oil runs past the pump's seals, and leaks out of every joint in the lines!
  9. compatability with o-ring chains is the biggy..
    i think the chainsaw oil is popular because it's so thin, but motor oil 100% compatible o-ring chain as quoted... just need high viscosity motor oil., synthetic if you're fussy.
    and it's probably what scott oil original is putting in their little refills anyway.
  10. Yeah its what i figured, just thought to ask. Same thing i saw Monkeyman, something compatible with o-ring and viscosity roughly the same. Might just stick some cheapo home brand oil it it (still got a litre or so from whatever i got it for *shrugs*) and see how i go.

    Pat i dont have THAT much oil pouring out... not more then what they would call the standard drop a minute anyway... maybe 45 seconds.
    Its set just below half way if thats any indication... Ive done about 10000km since installing it, and used half a litre - though rained plenty here all summer.
  11. And we have a winner. I'd put some 20W-50 through it and call it a day. You can pick up Gulf Western 20W-50 from Supercheap for around $15 per 4L jug.

    Cheers - boingk
  12. Owners manual for my cbr600f3 states the chain should be lubricated with 90w gear oil. Good enough for Honda, good enough for me - I put it on manually to each o ring with a oil can though, no scottoiler here.
  13. Trouble with gear oil is that it, and anything it touches, stinks. Agree that it's good lube for a chain though.
  14. I have about 200ml of shell's ultra 4 mineral engine oil that ive started using... (i graduated to fully synthetic for the engine, so might as well use it for something :p).
    Just a bit of the scottoiler stuff left in there so will see how it goes when it gets into the pipe in a few days ;).

    Ta for replies guys, wasnt sure if i had to use something specific for the stupid thing viscosity wise.
  15. Agree with PatB re reason for consumption. I only have it set at setting 2-3 in fine weather and maybe 4 in wet.

    I get 40,000k out of 500ml. Thats a lot of K's for $16 (ie at 5L/100k I've spent $2500 on fuel, let alone I'm just short of 100,000km on a DID ZVM2 on VFR 800 ridden every day rain, hail or shine).

    The amount of money saved by using $16/4L motor oil makes the exercise seem pointless to me.
  16. I agree with RedBruce as I filled mine up over 3 months ago and have ridden over 7000kms and its only at half way. I have mine on the lowest setting and it's sufficient.
  17. For me, it's not so much about money saving as it is about convenience. I have stacks of all sorts of oils sitting in the shed and can buy more from my local general store if needs be, but a bottle of special Scott oil would entail either mail order or a trip well out of my way to the nearest possible local stockist.

    As noted elsewhere, 19,000 kms now and I still haven't finished the original bottle. I'd guess I get 5-6000 kms out of a reservoir, and that's enough to get the bike pretty mucky (and rustproof :grin:) quite quickly.
  18. +1

    Changed the oil in my gearbox, swing arm and diff on my bike and when I came in the cat sniffed at my hands and then attacked me.
  19. Im talking new stuff, not used... I dont think the new stuff stinks that much... right?!