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NSW So I'm going to court tomorrow

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' at netrider.net.au started by Unconnected, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. Any pointers?

    Im fairly sure i just need to go there and say that i am pleading not guilty and then they set me another date at which point i need to get up there and defend my case and present evidence etc?

    This is because im challenging a ticket for not obeying a traffic lane arrow which occurred during the course of me filtering at the lights. I already have defeated another ticket from the same occasion via sdro appeal, however i only got 1/2 so now im going to court.

    But yeah, never been to court before, cant afford a lawyer so im giving it a shot myself, i have a long history of debating and have studied some law at uni, though there is sadly no 'introduction to traffic law' subject at any university i have been too.

    • Like Like x 1
  2. #2 Spots, Jan 9, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2013
    Paging Dr. Justus , Dr. Justus to the thread. ;)

    Best of luck. I can't really help in any direct sense as I've only ever been called as an expert witness a few times. All I can offer is that court is extremely adversarial (by design), which creates considerable emotional stress.

    Dress in a suit and tie or otherwise dress as in a way which shows respect to the Court.
    Bow to the Judge upon entering and before departing the courtroom.

    Try to imagine the questions you might be asked about your actions and decisions and your argument, and develop robust answers in your head so that when asked you already know what to say. It is likely you will receive difficult questions designed specifically to have you contradict yourself or otherwise lead you down a direction of thought the opposing side would like you to go down and you, by definition, would most likely not.

    Though, as you say you've studied law, I imagine you already know all this.
  3. I just went through the process. That about sums it up. Or should. I would be prepared to defend yourself tomorrow should it cone to that.
  4. *nods* sometimes they push thru with cases...especially only being a minor matter if you've gone to the effort of electing to go to court already then the prosecutor may already have all the information it needs on hand and proceed with the case then & there
  5. I reckon you have a pretty good shot with it if its the up the turning lane incident.

    Good luck with it and make sure you don't call the judge your highness or your majesty.
  6. yeah i read that sometimes it might all happen on one day, im hoping it wont, im already one day late for a week at the beach with mates. Oh well ill come prepared and hope that i dont have to do it all at once.

    Im supposed to call the judge your honour right?

    I found some good infomation on some state govt website for chumps like me who think they can have a go, at least i understand whats going on now.
  7. What are you going to court for? A mention or a hearing?
  8. Yes.
  9. Have you viewed the ICV?
  10. Make sure you read up on the relevant road rules you are relying on in your defence, so you don't get tripped up. Have some print outs of them tabbed so you can refer quickly should this be required. It will assist you in keeping your composure so you don't get embarrased and can focus on what is important. It is unlikely to be needed at the mention, however it is always good to be prepared. Good luck! Good effort for giving it a shot yourself.
  11. for a mention robsalvv,

    yeah i have some homework to do tonight thats for sure.

  12. #12 robsalvv, Jan 9, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2013
    At the "mention", you primarily talk with the prosecution and see whether you can resolve it amongst yourselves. At some point you appear before the mag to report your decision. If you intend to plead not guilty, you might be asked whether you're ready to proceed to a hearing - get it over and done with, or alternatively be given a date for the hearing. You can ask for a longer adjournment to give you time to help get your ducks in a row since you're intending to defend yourself (be ready to answer why you haven't approached legal aid) and maybe even ask for a different location better suited to your situation / logistics.

    (Sounds like you know SFA about court, so should at least review legal aid's "So you're going to court" leaflet (or similar title). Court is intimidating for the unitiated. )

    When you plead not guilty and you're actually in the "hearing", the other side need to make a case. You should already have the basis of their case, from their brief of evidence. This should have been given to you by the Prosecution/Police some time back, if not, then this alone is grounds for an adjournment at the very least - a good lawyer might be able to cheekily argue for a dismissal for denial of natural justice or some shit. But anyway, the prosecution will have to make the case. If the mag accepts it, you will need to pick holes in their case.

    On the other hand, given that you're representing yourself, some mag's will ask you simply for your side of the story... be aware that this could prove your guilt - you may inadvertently admit the infringement. In that case, you then need to argue why the penalty should be varied/reduced.

    You've left this a bit late mate.
    • Like Like x 1
  13. T,FTFY. :)
  14. You at downing centre?
  15. No, you are not in america.

    It is "Your Worship"

    Dont let them intimdate you. Tell yourself you are in the right and that you dont deserve this ticket and that you are just defending justice.

    Good luck.
  16. How many times you been in court vc? You ever seen letters Rt. Hon. next to a magistrates name?
  17. Haha, ring me next time Dr Spots. You don't get alerts on Tapa :p


    In historic times you would've been correct, but not in this day and age.


    In all states of Australia, magistrates are addressed as "Your Honour". It is also acceptable to address magistrates simply as "Sir" or "Madam"

    Link: Courtroom Etiquette.

    You've got that all arse-up Rob :confused: :LOL:

    It's not possible OP already has a brief of evidence when he hasn't even been to court yet. The brief will only be given at a later date IF he pleads not guilty. Police will then provide the CP and OP with the brief of evidence including all witness statements and proposed documentary exhibits, not less than 14 days before the hearing or at such other time as the magistrate determines. If its a minor offence as that being challenged by OP, the order to serve a brief of evidence will be on the day OP enters his plea of not guilty. See Sect 183 Criminal Procedure Act 1986, also confirmed by Local Court Practice Direction 2/2004.

    If police do not provide OP with the brief or it is not served in accordance with legislation, the police evidence is inadmissible. Refer to Sect 188. The magistrate will either adjourn the case, refuse to accept police evidence of the offence, or order that all or part of the brief not be served Sect 187.

    Court mention is not primarily a discussion "with the prosecution and see whether you can resolve it amongst yourselves". That is called 'Case Conference' and is relevant only for matters that are either strictly indictable or those matters tabled in Schedule 1 of Criminal Procedure Act 1986.

    Court mention is where OP, before a magistrate will let the Court know of his intent to plead Not Guilty. Magistrate then adjourns and OP is done. A brief appearance, 10 minutes, if that.

    Nothing has been left late. The date to determine the matter has not even been established yet ;)

    You will be called up to the bar table. The magistrate will ask how do you plead to which you will reply: "No guilty your honour"

    How many pointers do you need to utter four words? You'll be OK.

    Link: Developing Confidence in the Courtroom

    Link: Preparing a defended hearing in a local court

    • Like Like x 3
  18. Thanks justus,

    That was my understanding at least, the reason why i havent done anything is because i did think i just had to show up and say not guilty then i had a few months to sort out my case. I got a bit freaked out this morning when i read 'going to court' and it said it might all go down on the same day, on the off chance of that happening (though with justus's above post it seems thats almost certainly not going to happen) I already have most stuff prepared since doing the sdro stuff.
    I also have not been provided with brief of evidence, so good to know thats normal.

    As for why i dont have legal aid, i dont think i qualify, my intention is to get advice or representation from the union lawyers at uni potentially.
  19. If you are going to a Victorian Magistrates' Court, you should refer to the Magistrate as 'Your Honour'.

    'Your Worship' was dropped a couple of years ago.

    If you were booked by HWP you might expect to see in car video footage of the alleged offence.
  20. To my knowledge, even if the person behind the table is a magistrate, they are not acting in capacity as a magistrate but rather a court officer (or similar)?