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Side car - Learner [vic]

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' at netrider.net.au started by Mendy, Nov 4, 2009.

  1. Sorry mods if it's in the wrong section, but didn't know where to post it.

    Does anyone know if it's legal to have a side car on your learners. For let's say a dog or something. I checked on Vic roads and it only says no trailers behind bike.
    Any other way to move a not-so-small dog around legally, as my car is buggered and might not put it back on the road for some time.
    Thank's for any help
  2. Re: Side car - Learner

    A side car becomes the motor vehicle, so you can drive it on P's
    Just keep remembering it is there, Riding a bike. you forget about the chair,
    My mate in the chair was screaming at me. I was just about to start filtering and I was going to ram him into the back of a car. Hahahahahahaha I had forgotten about the width of the chair.
  3. Re: Side car - Learner

    So I have to wait until my P's ?
  4.  Top
  5. Re: Side car - Learner

    I concur.
    After much searching on the VicRoads database I would say that riding with a sidecar on your L's is acceptable.

    Only trailers are restricted.
  6. Re: Side car - Learner

    lol filtering
  7. Re: Side car - Learner

    I wonder if you can actually take a dog in a sidecar anymore given the rule changes? The sidecar wont do anything to help you learn to ride a motorcycle though, totally different dynamics.
  8. Re: Side car - Learner

    why....... you must love your dog.

  9. Re: Side car - Learner

    im pretty sure you cant use one in vic on L's... i admit i did the test over a month ago and all but im fairly sure they were saying you cant have a sidecar or tow with a bike nor have a pillion untill after you have a full licence? but im probbably wrong ill see if i can find the bike Ls book when i get home tonight and be sure.
  10. Re: Side car - Learner

    Reading the '09 Rider's Handbook as per Moto2's link, it says nothing about the legality of riding an outfit on your Ls, but it does noticeably speak of sidecars and trailors in the same breath and specify that trailors are banned on your Ls, while saying nothing of sidecars. Unless it's mentioned specifically somewhere as disallowed then, well, I guess you're allowed!

    Re the law and dogs, isn't it only a ban on dogs on the tank (forward of the rider or something)? Dogs in shoulder bags are not outlawed, nor dogs in top-box type arrangements, so I assume....

    I've bought a sidecar and will hook it up at some point. I'd love to see yours when you do it. I also know somebody in Melbourne who's selling a great sidecar (a Cozy or Inder) for $1500, as well as - if you don't know any sidecarists - a fellow who knows all about these things and is very ready to give advice / help to new sidecarists, with whom I can put you in touch. If you've got a chassis (always going cheap on eBay) and just need a boat, I'll sell my rough old 1951 Murphy 'child double' for $100 - I'm just using the chassis that it came with (I'm going Mad Max for the boat, not classic).
  11. Re: Side car - Learner

    Hey what you going to tow the chassis with ??
  12. Not clear what you mean (assuming you were speaking to me, not the op).
  13. hmm, a sidecar would be interesting for the MOST test...
  14. You can't use them for your test in Vic (nor, I think, for anywhere in Aus, and I've heard complaints from the US about this too). Not an issue really, except I wonder if there's an exemption for disabled riders who can only ride an outfit or trike?
  15. A friend (who has been riding for 23 years) told me when I asked about the sidecar issue, that it's known as a lazy wheel?, and you do not need a bike liscence as it's not regarded one.
    Anyone want to shed some light on this.
  16. Perhaps the esteemed Chairman could respond...
    He's in a position to verify this.

  17. Re: Side car - Learner

  18. I've been told by some owners that Vic Roads lists it as an accessory. You don't need a RWC (I posted about this on here a while back), though the Vic Roads staff often don't know what to do about it themselves. You do need a bike license though, for the reason that it is considered a bike with an accesory. Different laws in other countries, incl not needing helmets, but here it's basically the same deal as riding a solo bike.

    The esteemed Phil Duffy fitted a mild-crate seat to a chassis, and his son rode around on it with his girlfriend in the milk-crate. Cops pulled him over, had him there for an hour, called for back up, the girl caught the bus, the back-up smirked and kept driving, and nothing was done in the end! The laws are quite vague. (Let's hope they stay that way!)

    Patb's another good advisor here on sidecars - check out his razorback story.

    Another option is to make up a top box, maybe out of a really solid pet carrier. How big's your dog? But, that would mean no sidecar, and where's the fun in that? Also means you can fit car tyres and save lots of money.
  19. I have to admit I'm not fully up on Australian learner laws, solo or combo, as I've never been personally impacted by them.

    Here in WA, a motorcycle with a sidecar is regarded as a motorcycle in the eyes of the law. eg. the sidecar passenger is regarded as a passenger on the motorcycle and, as such, must wear a helmet.

    The corollary to this is that the sidecar is regarded as part of the motorcycle and does not require separate rego, insurance etc.

    It's a long time since I looked at the Driver Licensing Regulations, but I don't remember specific mention of sidecars and learners.

    Given the above, I'd be fairly confident that, as long as the tug was a learner legal bike, it would be OK for a learner to ride. However, as the above only applies to WA, and WA retains a 250 learner law, it's a bit academic. You can put a sidecar on a 250, but I'm not sure why :?. Anyway, along with that, I'd assume that any passenger ban laws would also apply to the sidecar under these circumstances due to the first point above.

    As it appears that you can't take your test on an outfit, riding one on Ls seems a little pointless (apart from people with physical disabilities that preclude solos) as you learn a completely different skill set. Habits learned on a combo will kill you on a solo and vice versa (only more so).

    This, of course, sharply contrasts with the situation in the UK when I was younger, where learners were restricted to 12 bhp 125 solos, but could ride, without restriction, any bike fitted with a sidecar. Cue the CBR1000F (the max speed champion of the late 80s) with a length of broom handle and a castor gaffer taped to the side :eek:hno:. Well, maybe not that bad, but companies like Sidewinder made a very good income selling wheeled plastic shower trays that would, allegedly, not upset the handling of your L-plated superbike. Not 'til you ran out of lean, having overcooked a left-hander anyway, at which point, after you'd gone under the oncoming artic (not semi-this was the UK, remember), the cause of all the trouble would be indistinguishable from the smashed plastic from the bike, the additional wheel could be explained away as having fallen from the nearest roadworks' wheelbarrow and you'd be far to flat to initiate litigation.

    And, don't forget, it was entirely legal for someone who'd never before been in control of a motorised vehicle, to drive such a 100 hp deathtrap straight out of the showroom and onto the public road with no formal training whatsoever :shock:.

    Of course, in reality, this didn't actually happen much, thanks to financial restrictions, sky-high (and compulsory) insurance and, I'd like to think, the inherent good sense of the general motorcycling population.

    What it did allow people to do was to avoid having to buy a ruinously expensive and totally knackered secondhand 125 to learn and pass their test on. In the meantime, they could carry the odd passenger in the chair (sidecar passenger was legal, pillion was not, for learners), have a machine with a bit more reserve of performance and a bit more size than a 125 which was particularly useful for those of larger dimensions, ride something not made in Japan that wasn't a BSA Bantam or some terrible, Villiers powered, autocycle thing and could generally cut a bit of a mildly eccentric dash.

    And yes, you could take your UK test on an outfit. Both MrsB and MrBSenior attained their full motorcycle licenses on three wheels. Maybe you still can.

    I left it until a bit later in my biking career, but I wish I hadn't.