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Sackings Needed at Honda

Discussion in 'Racing, Motorsports, and Track Days' started by rc36, Aug 1, 2005.

  1. After the Honda riders' dismal efforts at Saschenring last night, it's about time Honda bit the bullet and sacked most of their riders and hired some who have some guts and determination and who can take it up to Rossi.

    Fisrt to go should be "Glass Jaw" Gibernau. Top class riders don't give races away like he did last night and smile about it afterwards at the Press Conference.

    Biaggi is past it Despite all his protestations, he is still riding the MotoGp bike like a 250 and he has shown no potential to beat Rossi. Rossi psyched him out a couple of years ago and he has never recovered.

    Barros's occassional victories do not make up for his inconsistencies and lack of ability to beat Rossi fair and square.

    Sadly, I have to say that Troy Bayliss is also in the same boat. Not only can he not beat Rossi, he can't even beat his own teammate.

    Tamada has crashed himself out of contention. Now that he knows how much it hurts, he will not be as fast and as dynamic as he was when he first burst on the scene at Sugo during the World Supers some years ago.

    Melandri is riding the Honda like he used to ride the Yamaha and it simply doesn't work. I've always been a Melandri fan, but he's on borrowed time. Unless he stops crashing and starts putting in some sensational rides, he will have to go too.

    Evidence of this is the problem that Edwards is having at the moment. he's doing the opposite; he's riding the Yamaha like it was Honda and it's not working either.

    Hayden can stay at the moment. He has shown real pace and is starting to show some real promise.

    So, where to from here?

    Pedrosa is signed. Who else?

    Vermeulen, obviously. His 2nd place at Suzuka last night has only increased the already great likelihood that he will be in MotoGp next year.

    Any suggestions, Netriders?
  2. Have to agree with you and the criticism of the current crop of riders. My wife and I could not believe it when Gibernau ran wide, we were sitting there saying choker choker.
    But as to who will replace them, now that is an interesting question.
    Vermuelen is a good pick, though do not know how well he will do on the gp monster, same as Pedrosa, he is a very small man. Others that could do it? hmm let me see. Karl Muggeridge (sp) could be one, Pedrosa's team mate in the 250's as well could be another.
    Other than that well, the pool is a little shallow, though it just depends on how much money they want to throw at the problem, and the problem is that Rossi is just so good.
  3. Get rid on Valentino and you'll have a pretty competetive field :)

    Biaggi is the only one I can see who definitely needs to go, most of the others are scoring regular points, but having said that there is a lot of talent in the 250 class and WSBK that motogp teams will want to exploit...
  4. well the answer to that is tell him to leave (reason being) we can't find anyone else as good as you and you making a mockery (sp) of the rest of the field and the sport. :p
  5. [quote="
    So, where to from here?

    Pedrosa is signed. Who else?

    Vermeulen, obviously. His 2nd place at Suzuka last night has only increased the already great likelihood that he will be in MotoGp next year.

    Any suggestions, Netriders?[/quote]

    Vermulan is Signed for Honda in MotoGP for next year and that is a fact!
  6. They are scoring pints, yes, but they are NOT winning races and they are NOT beating Rossi, nor are they LOOKING like doing so any time soon.

    How far ahead is Rossi in the points now?? 120 points!!!

    That's 4.8 race wins better than the guy (Melandri) who's coming 2nd and he hasn't even won a race this year!!!

    Rossi would need to retire from 5 races and Melandri would have to win them all for it to be even close.

    C'mon Dan, it's not about scoring points, it's a bout WINNING, and they're not, none of them, nor do they look like doing so!

    Not angry here (well, yes I am, I'm angry at Honda for letting VR go), but they have to clear the decks.

    Now the trouble is that, as you stated, if they do, blooding a whole lot of new riders will inevitably mean a couple more years of Rossi domination, but NOT acting is going to lead to the same thing with NO hope of an improvement in the future.

    Honda must act now. Bite the bullet and rebuild for the future.

    IMHO anyway.
  7. The blokes the best of all time - you could hire and fire 50 riders and he'd still win - he and his team are too good.
    And he's on 236 points - the next 6 riders are all on 101-116 points - it's still competetive between them, just not with Rossi.
  8. Agreed.
    BUT, Rossi has these "best of the best" riders thoroughly psyched out. They've been around too long and he knows he can mess with their minds.
    What's needed is some new, younger riders who aren't scared of him. I admit that he will still win a lot, but not like he is at the moment.
  9. Rossi gets a Harley.
    Everyone else gets NOS.
    Close racing ensues.
  10. Well I spose they could have broken his legs...

    Isn't VR's move to Yamaha analogous to Lawson's move to Honda: to win on another bike is the best way to challenge yourself and prove your superiority.

    So, when's he going to sign with Kawasaki or Suzuki?
  11. Rossi's signing with Yamaha was for one reason and one reason only.

    For years while he was at Honda and Biaggi was at Yamaha, Biaggi whined that, given equal bikes, he could beat Rossi.

    So, when Biaggi went to Honda he still couldn't beat him because Biaggi claimed that he wasn't getting equal bikes.

    Then, when Biaggi was GIVEN equal equipment to Rossi, he STILL couldn't beat him.

    Rossi's move to Yamaha had everything to do with showing Biaggi that, on a LESSER bike, he could still beat him.

    I have a friend who is very close to the Suzuki GP team and he said that Rossi had said this in private and everyone in the paddock knew it!!!

    I know that there could be all sorts of rationales for it, but I believe Stuart when he said that that was the main reason Rossi gave.
  12. Now, here's another issue related to this. I just did a quick search on the MotoGp web site for ages of riders.

    It makes very interesting reading.

    Rossi, as we know, is 26 years old

    Here are the ages of the Honda Riders

    Tamada 28
    Gibernau 32
    Barros 34
    Biaggi 34
    Bayliss 36

    Hayden 24
    Melandri 23

    Interesting, eh?
  13. A valid point, ruined with some what-planet-are-you-on musings...

    In all his time in the GP's, Bayliss had never been considered a championship contender.

    Yes, because it's not like he'd ever crashed before this year; after all, he'd only been an All-Japan competitor since 1998, and they race on tracks lined with mounds of marshmallows there.

    Ah-huh; and, pray tell, how does one do that?

    So far this season, he's fallen twice in ten races; at Laguna, which is a track he's never raced on before, where he came off from within the leading pack on the first lap, and at Donnington, where he was in the 60% of the field who stacked it in the pissing rain.

    In the eight races he has finished, he's been on the podium for four of them, just off the podium (fourth) on three, and his worst finish, just last night, was seventh.

  14. RC, I'm with you :!: :!:
    Sack the whole bloody lot... :idea: :idea: replace all of them with NetRiders and sign Rossi on a CT110 (he'd still cream all of us) :p :p :p :p
  15. Trouble is, glitch, you're absolutely right!
    He used to race pocket bikes when he was a teenager and was apparently rather good at them too, dammit!
  16. there are still some good young riders out there, Stoner and West just to name two.

    You also have Ryuichi Kiyonari currently riding a Honda, and Leon Haslam on a Ducati both in the British Super Bikes series.

    There is one other guy I don't know his name but he ripped it past me a couple of weeks ago going down to the Island and I reckon he was doing way in excess of 2 ton.
  17. Can't help but feel that Honda have diluted the talent too much. Providing the backing for essentially seven factory rides (although Camel and Telefonica are satellite teams) means that each rider is scoring points off all the other riders. Honda, have gone out to win constructors championship but don't appear to be doing that very well as only two GP wins and quite a number have fallen off, with only an average of three of the bikes finishing per race.
    Current rumours that appear to have a high degree of factual content (some of which have now been confirmed) are:
    i) Bayliss out of Camel
    ii) Biaggi out of Repsol
    iii) Barros to stay at Camel
    iv) Pedrosa to Repsol
    v) Hayden to stay at Repsol
    vi) Melandri and Gibernau to stay at Telefonica
    vii) Capirossi wants out of Ducati
    viii) Bayliss in talks with Ducati again

    So where does Vermulen go? Personally I think he will be Biaggi's garage mate at Camel and Barros out in the cold.
  18. West, without question (anybody who can be 165cm tall but have a voice that deep, you gotta give props to), especially now that he's having his first taste of a proper factory team, and on an up-and-coming bike, too. So, he's getting used to getting stuff for the bike when he asks for it, which he'll be able to use when (or if; he's still likely to take over from Jeremy McWilliams as the most-overlooked rider in the paddock) he gets back into the big bikes. Also, unlike guys like Stoner and Pedrosa, he's already ridden in the top class; the bikes won't come as such a shock to him.

    He's probably a full season away from MotoGP, though; KTM will want to have a serious tilt at the title with him. If that happens, and he does either win or come very close, he'll not only get snapped up by a leading MotoGP team (there'll still be plenty of dead wood around there), he'll stride back into the paddock thinking, "I can take all you muthaphuquaz".

    Here's a crystal-ball gaze; he gets snapped up by Kawasaki just as their effort winds up for a shot at the title.

    Haslam, though, don't forget, now has an ever-lenghtening line of successively less challenging rides on which he's underperformed; he started out in the 250's, got bumped up onto a 500 (he was Chris Walker's teammate in 2001, remember; started out on the twin, then got Walker's V4 when he got the arse halfway through the season), then down onto a WSB Ducati for a couple of years, then onto a BSB Ducati... everywhere, he was a midfield rider.

    Fair enough, he's still ridiculously young, but...

    You might be onto something with Kiyonari, though.
  19. Biaggi going to try NOS next year? Or traction control? This bloke has been squirreling away his paycheck into the super fund since Rossi gave him the finger. He's on an absolute hiding to nothing, mentally shattered and is only in the team because he's an italian pin-up boy who the sponsors like. 8)
  20. Absolutely but still performing more consistently than Barros. That's the only reason Careless Chucker and Loris Capirossi are riding for Ducati because the Italians wanted Italians riding Italian bikes rather than Bayliss.