Welcome to Netrider ... Connecting Riders!

Interested in talking motorbikes with a terrific community of riders?
Signup (it's quick and free) to join the discussions and access the full suite of tools and information that Netrider has to offer.

RBT and Licence Checks are mutually exclusive.

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' started by bunabaroo, Dec 3, 2005.

  1. Or at least they used to be.

    When the law was drafted in NSW a Random Breath Test was just that. If you passed the test anything more, like a rego or licence check, was an invasion of your privacy as the police hadn't any cause to stop you in the first place.

    I've tested this on Sydney coppers. Two years ago I was directed to pull over and told I was being subjected to an RBT. After the test was completed and passed the officer asked to see my drivers licence. I refused to produce it, using the same explanation as in the previous paragraph. The copper sent me on my merry way.

    In the last year a number of my friends and family have been subjected to RBTs (all have passed the test) and have been asked to produce thier licences. Those who have refused have been told they have to. To avoid fights with the coppers they have complied and shown thier licences.

    If I am pulled for speeding or driving erratically or because my vehicle gives the impression of being unroadworthy then its another story and they can check whatever they like. But an RBT is being pulled for doing nothing wrong.

    Has the law been changed or are the police taking the piss and misrepresenting the law to suit themselves?

    Does anyone else have any experience with this situation? What does the law say in other states?
  2. What's the problem anyway? If RBT and license checks get drunken and unlicensed drivers off our roads, which apparantly account for well over 60% of all accidents, then I don't see what the problem is.

    Safer roads for the rest of us riders. They can ask me for my license at the same time. I don't care. There's a serious problem in accidents in that unlicensed drivers and/or unregistered cars are severely over-represented (by a factor of something like 10:1 I think I read once - hard to say - since the number of un-drivers on the road isn't actually known) in multi-vehicle accidents. Catch 'em and get 'em off the road.
  3. Thanks Cathar, yours is a valid opinion and one that I'm sure many others share.

    What I'm trying to ascertain in this case is whether or not the police are misrepresenting the laws to suit themselves. It is important to me because we set the laws through our elected representatives, the job of the police is merely to enforce existing laws, not modify them to make thier lives easier.
  4. I do see your point. You might like to go to the NSW Road Traffic Authority website and poke around in the on-line legislative papers. Am unsure of the actual links, but here in Victoria such things are all available on-line and I would image they would be in NSW too.

    Still, it wouldn't surprise me if the law had been amended to allow for license checks at the same time too in the last couple of years. Road laws seem to have been tightened up dramatically in almost every state in the last few years, presumably as the result of a knee-jerk reaction to the growing realisation that speed-cameras aren't actually fixing the problem (but they sure are a nice revenue stream).

    A quick check of the relevent legislation would reveal all.
  5. Seems that the laws were changed this year. See Section 150, and section 171 of the 2005 traffic acts amendments:

  6. Indeed Cather.

    Thanks for your references, that all makes interesting reading.

    There goes another freedom, where will it end?
  7. What freedom is lost, for God's sake?????????????

    If you are pulled over for an RBT, they test for alcohol. If they decide to check your licence as well, they are entitled to do so.

    Jeez, some people round here have either got something to hide, or a chip on both shoulders, or both :evil:
  8. Or just worried about the slow and steady arming of our police forces with Gestapo like powers.
  9. C'mon Dan, police have always had the right to demand your licence, what's new here? Back in the 50's they had the 'right' to throw you down the back stairs of the police station before you appeared before the magistrate, or bash you up in a back alley 'just as a warning'. Are you saying you want to go back to THOSE good old days??
  10. Can I read that act?
  11. Even the gestapo weren't armed with such awesome and invasive powers as the ability to ask for licenses...

    The only solution.
  12. Don't knock the power of tinfoil! :LOL:
  13. Personally I say "I don't mind" I have to jump through so many hoops to get the bloody things in the first place that I'm looking for an excuse to show someone!!! :shock: We have a real problem out here of unlicenced riders / unregistered bikes no helmet crap. They give the legit riders a bad rep. Check licences I say. If you're worried about increased police powers well I worry too, about why there are so many "offenders" rights and protections.

    But thats another thread... :twisted:
  14. I agree. Your licence is required by law to be carried whenever you drive a motor vehicle, so why shouldn't they be able to ask you for it, as legally you should have it on you. Also i don't see why they can't do a simple random road worthy (i.e check tyres, rego and lights) while they have you pulled over. It would certainly save alot of time and get alot of un-roadworthy death traps fixed.
  15. My dearly departed grandparents had some experience with the Gestapo during WW2 living in Holland and no one really knew what power they had but no one was really game to ask or argue with them either.

    Victoria Booze & Bong Buses do rego checks on vehicles (ever noticed the other copper looking at your rego label) as you blow in the bag.

    I've got nothing to hide, except for the body in the boot :wink: so I don't have a problem unless they shut down a freeway at midnight and turn a 10 minute trip into a 40 minute one instead.
  16. In SA well at lleast for a while , they would also let the dogs have a walk around your vehicle for a quick sniff. DO they still do that in SA ?
  17. When did this change?
  18. Well notionally the police are today under greater scrutiny than then, and that was the point I was trying to make, that whether or not it was legal, rights were infringed on MORE then than by legislation being made now.....
  19. When I lived in The UK, it was not a requirement that you carry your licence at all. You were given a 'notice to produce', and had 7 days to rock up at a police station of your choice with your documents. It had to do with it being seen as having to carry compulsory I.D, which was in turn seen as an infringement of personal freedom. It may have changed by now though.