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VIC Phillip Island circuit tips and notes?

Discussion in 'Racing, Motorsports, and Track Days' started by steve265, Sep 14, 2011.

  1. Hey riders,

    Just interested in getting a few peoples takes on tackling the phillip island gp circuit, like your track and corner notes specifically. Anyone who does a lot of track days will likely know a lot of tips and pointers..

    I have had a bit of a dig around but pickings were slim (if there are threads please link) I only found stuff like T1 down two gears to 4th, T2 down to 3rd etc.

    I'd like to hear how people ride the island for a quick lap on a 600 or 1000 superbike. Do you have preferred lines you take for some corners and where are good passing opportunities? Would be interesting to hear about traps for beginners and places where you can make up time.

  2. Good question Steve...I'm interested in this too! Thous please :)

    My notes look sometyhing like this:

    Main straight - holy shit
    T1 - holy shit
    T2 - holy shit
    • Like Like x 1
  3. And which one did you slide at? :) only a bruised finger!! good thing you know how to fall!!
  4. Turn 8.

    I lead with my head when I crash. Helps protect the limbs ;)
  5. Thats what they build helmets for isnt it? :)
  6. what is your current skill level? its hard to give advice to someone and specific track things if they are too far off the pace to begin with.

    don't worry about passing opportunities unless you are racing.

    i've only ridden there once but these are the things i picked up on. my lap time wasnt amazing but i think if i went back now i would be alot faster.

    a general thing is that you make up more time in faster corners than slow ones. so don't go too crazy at turn 4 and turn 10, as it won't necessarily give you much of a faster lap time. basically alot of late apexes on this track if you ride a 1000, trying to 'square off' the turns so you can get on the gas earlier and harder.

    try to keep the right half of the track between turn 1 and 2. turn 2 is double apex and make the last one as late as possible to lengthen the run into 3. you can get on the gas earlier than you think in turn 2. turn 3 stay wide on the run up, tip in as the track drops away from you. i then get on the gas hard to slide the rear around to try and turn the bike to go for the outside of the track on the way into 4. obviously i'm not doing it as well as stoner haha but i try.

    late apex in siberia to get you a good run into the next section. i noticed a few bumps on the outside so keep that in mind. stick to the left side of the track in turn 7 (to make turn 8 less of a turn). run out of turn 8 into about the middle of the track. run lukey heights as a double apex as well, tip in for the first one, pick up the throttle and the second one should be a bit before the top of the crest.

    obviously late apex again on turn 10, short shift for 11 and make sure you get good drive out of here as it will set you up for the straight. then last turn just go in as late as you can to make the straight long.

    dunno, its what i tried but i was mostly too scared to do it all properly.

    i'm sure a guy who has ridden here a bit and is good with words will pop in here soon... [MENTION=16699]raven[/MENTION] is someone who can turn a lap around here and is pretty good at getting things across with words.
  7. Just for something to do, I just now took a map of PI and tried to note down where I think I tip in and apex (or at least where I think I should :))...

    Happy to hear comments.

  8. on southern loop you left the first apex too late on the map. i dont think its possible to ride that line with any sort of speed.

    i try and come in too fast, as in coming in fast enough that the bike will try and run wide at the first apex, then turning the bike and smashing the throttle down hard.

    as the track drops away there and has a fair bit of on-camber (working from memory haha, i'm sure its got some camber there) you can open it right up hard.

    on a track like this, getting your bike to lean right over as quick as you can has huge benefits. if you can half the time it takes you to lean the bike over, you will be able to brake later and tip in later. when you take a long time to get the bike on its side, it will take the bike a long time to change direction.

    watch Sylvain Guintoli around the island and you will see what i mean. on this onboard video you can really see how much he slides the bike on the throttle (squaring off the turns) and the speed that he leans the bike over.

  9. Thanks jimmyd!

    His lines look a bit different to mine. He tips in earlier and doesn't start as wide as I do on many corners.

    Mind you, I'm a very green noob and I go really slow.

  10. Here's a good video of a CSS staff cutting a fast lap.

    Turn 1, I tap the brakes on the 3rd marker (left side line), one gear down and tip in...holding throttle partially or sometimes full lock.

    This is on a VFR400 though, so not too sure about bigger bikes.

    Also between T11 and T12 (according to the map above) you might need to short shift before going into T12. On the 400, I short shift from 3rd to 4th so that I don't have to shift mid corner or hold it on the red line through the corner...I come out of the turn just under redline and shift into 5th as I straighten up.

  11. Interesting vid.he's more or less running tge full-on racing line which is different to the average track day riders.
    Ie Sothern loop - i forget all about the first apex and run a line that is initially wider. I more or less go in too hot like JD does, let the bike drift wide with the throttle shut, then begin to feed on the power as the bike begins to tighten up. Once it has, i can pick it up with a counter steer, which allows me to be close to wide open on the throttles, just as i intersect with the second apex. It allows me to carry more speed down the hill to the kink and then Honda Corner.

    If i was actually good enough to race, i would NOT be leaving an inside line wide open for an inside pass...so i would'nt run the corner that way. I'd have to stay tight to protect my inside more, like the fellow does in the vid.

    I won't go into it but a few other sections are different also.
  12. The way i run pi is not the real racing line. It's a track day line for non-slick, but good sports tyres. And i can punt around ok, but by no means am i one of the really fas guys.

    Anyway...position far left of the straight, after the tower. About 250k in 6th, quick hard braking and down 2 gears, release and pitch in to apex, back on the throttle a bit, and hold the corner longer and tight so i stay on rh side of the track.
    A quick bit of gas as i run up to southrn loop and down to 3rd.
    Let bike push wide, as speed comes off, then winding on power as i spot the second apex.

    Wide open down the hill aiming right for the lh sweeper, and feather the throttle through sweeper to stay left, and wide open for a bit , before hard on the brake for Honda.
    Honda rewards deep braking, so stay wide, go in deep and very quick turn.
    You will feel like you are going past the corner, if you get right.
    With a solid quick turn you will hit the backside of the apparant apex more upright, so you can get hard on the gas early.
    Let the bike run wide to the left as exiting, then push right to get it over to the far right for siberia. I usually just get 4th, then back down to 3rd.
    Siberia has a a solid positive camber, so go in hot, then push it over for a late apex here. you can get on the gas earlier here, and let the bike run wide. The bumps lift the 675 briefly, but a thou could get a bit high, and you need to push over hard to get as far left as possible through the kink, so you are set very wide for turn in, to hayshed.
    Hayshed is a tricky corner that is surprisingly tight at speed, and you must hold the turn longer than you expect to prevent running OFF.
    you need to get back to the rh side to late turn over lukey heights. The real apex for a late turn here is over the hill beyond visual range.
    You cannot!!, run wide here, or you could easily be OFF, so hold the turn harder if necessary to make sure you get back to the apex, and maintain the turn for a left side exit, as you bang down the gears.
    MG, requires a late turn for a late apex, and hold it to keep right, to line up for turn 11. Usually a quick change befor you pitch over through turn 11, and keep the power on, letting the bike run out to the right, and another quick change so you have some overhead for exiting turn 12.
    Turn 12 is difficult because it goes for so long, and will really test the lh side of the tyres, AND your left quads.
    You need to apex late or if you get a little early, hold your line. Dot not let the bike run out to early. It is easy to run OFF, if you let the corner unwind prematurely.
    You are approaching the straight blind, so pay attention as you come over the rise and onto the straight. It's a matter of timing here. Early on the gas and you'll get a hot run onto the straight and carry speed. After you get a feel for it, you'll know when to get on the power, just as long as you hold it tight through twelve, and then release it to use the full width of the straight.

    That's my basic lap. And i think fairly similar to JD.
    i run in the upper intermediate group, as i usually only have less than 10 out of 30 bikes i need worry about. Of course, i could run in 'fastest' group, but i'd stay at the back where i can just ride my ride, but i usually end up mixing it with blokes who's ego puts them in the fastest group, but who's ability matches one group down, where i run.

    That's briefly what i do, or how i approach PI.

    JD, i thought your explanation was a pretty good effort mate. I don't think mine's any better. :)
  13. ^^^ Oh yeah John, I'm looking forward to hitting PI again and this time with you in tow!
    Nice writeup and also from Jimmy :)
    I agree that Hayshed is a deceiving little f&%#er and rather looks like a slight kink/turn but when you're on it, the corner does seem rather tight.

    Definitely stick to the inside of turn 1 as if you you go a few metres out from the ripple strip it's quite bumpy and it's not very pleasant hitting bumps at silly speeds.

  14. it'll be very cool mate. I won't be pushing it to my limits...and want to reaquaint myself with southern loop, so i can get the groove going.
    And our two bikes, are close enough to make it easy. :)

    I'm getting impatient waiting! LOL :)
  15. Is the op a bit suss?
    Joined in aug 2008, and this is the one and only post in all that time?
    May be trolling? (says my skepticometer)
  16. yeah sometimes its not ideal to use every piece of the track, it may make you compromise your braking or something. like into turn 6, you watch Sylvain and he pretty much starts from the middle of the track, not the outside.

    as to start from the outside you would have to turn more at 5 and then 6 will be a sharper turn also. so thats not idea.

    meh, i think its a good topic that will be helpful for a few people.

    having thought about it a bit more, the entry to southern loop is very similar to the entry to the last turn at broadford. like you come in too hot, let the bike push you wide then get it turned and get back on the gas. or thats how i do the last turn of broadford anyway.

    but doing the last turn of broadford like that leaves you open for people to stuff it up the inside of you then block you out from getting on the gas.

    but i am far from a PI expert, only ridden there once and have ridden in a v8 supercar around there. but hopefully in a few years i'll be nearly under 1:40 laps but dunno, easier said than done.
  17. Nice one boys. Great replies. Love that video of Sylvain Guintoli, he's cutting stellar laps there...

    Great insight jimmyd and raven that helps a lot and I'm sure many riders will glean some good info from talking and thinking about it.

    Hopefully that's not how it comes across! haha
    I love to read on here and I didn't realise that was my first post, hello everyone, good to be here.

    If anybody has more to add keep it coming, learning a lot here

  18. Steve, fair enough mate. My apologies for being a skeptical chap.
    Happy to help out, mate.
  19. Mmm.... I think his lines are racing lines, where you cannot aford to leave your inside uncovered. Us mere mortals can use more track because we are'nt running race pace. ( just are'nt that fast )

    Naturally as your pace improves, you have less and less time to use the whole track.
    In that case you would be on slicks and keeping a tighter line, mate. And running the lines, both vids show.

    And what are you doing at broadford.!? It's fun but it's a bit of a goat track by comparison to PI. (not saying it's a shite track)
  20. I'll hilight a few points, just for simple clarity's sake.

    Firstly. PI is a high speed track, so mistakes can end in BIG crashes. You have to respect certain corners, for several reasons.

    Turn 1. It's faaaast, and you have properly finish the corner before you unwind.

    Southern Loop. It's a double apex, so ignore the first one, ride for the second apex.

    Honda Corner. Big brake technique, and timing tester. Must stay wide and quick turn, so it reeeally tests your ability to go from hard braking to turn in.

    Siberia. Great positive camber that allows you to get on the gas earlier. But make it a late apex so you get a better run up the rise.

    Hayshed. An easy looking rh corner without camber. You must hold turn tight and for longer. It's a highspeed corner, so a bad mistake will munch you. You cannot run wide. The outside of the corner is deceptive close at speed.

    Lukey heights. Do NOT run wide through here. It's another corner where you must hold the turn longer than it appears. The bike goes light over the top, testing your grip levels. You need a steady and even throttle here.

    MG and T11. MG is a very tight corner. Not much for the average Joe to gain here, but you exit is critical, as it sets you up for T11. You will need to short shift up to T11 to give yourself head room for T12.

    T12. Has good positive camber that disappears suddenly as you transition onto the straight. The corner is long and you must keep it tight after apexing, and not unwind the turn too early. The change in camber coincides with slight ridge before you line up for the straight, you cannot run wide on the exit. You need to learn this corner.

    These are my tick points for the track, based on how 'high-Intermediate' riders will run, give or take, without slicks.