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[OT] Chasing someone for money...(long)

Discussion in 'General Motorcycling Discussion' at netrider.net.au started by Kurtis_Strange, Jan 24, 2006.

  1. I'm 90% sure I'm getting fcuked around here but thought I'd get a different opinion on it...

    I'm a Freelance Graphic Artist so basically move around working for various companies on short & long term contract, usually through agencies who pay me so its not normally an issue.

    Occasionally I will work for someone direct and invoice them with the agreement of prompt payment, this is one of those situations...

    Got a call 3 weeks ago from some guy up in Gosford who had contacted me via a website where I had put up my CV. Said he was urgently looking for someone to help out over the next 3 days, would I be interested and did I have any references. I wasn't doing anything at the time so said sure...sent him references which he checked out, we agreed on a trial basis (below rate) price for the 3 days and I went up there.

    It was clearly a small outfit, smaller than he had made it out to be over the phone and I also quickly realised that his 'partner'/studio manager in the business was also his partner personaly. They never disclosed this though and from what I can tell do everything possible not to purvey this, however it was confirmed to me by one of the girls working there.

    A red flag to me (why wouldn't they tell me that) but anyway the environment was professional and over the next 3 days we got the job done, and the client was happy as were they.

    It was left with the guy who I had been doing all the negotiating with on the Friday that I would send him an invoice which would "go through" on the Monday. He told me he would be calling me tomorrow morning (Sat) to confirm a roll out as they would likely need me back next week.

    That was fine, however he didn't call on Saturday....I thought well its the weekend so expected to hear from him on Monday as I emailed him the invoice over the weekend. Didn't call on Monday.

    So Monday night I email him checking he received the invoice and that I wanted to touch base with him re work so I could plan my week...

    First thing Tuesday morning I get an email thanking me for the work etc and that "he was just going into a meeting and would have a proposal for me when he got out"....by 4.30 I had heard nothing so called him explaining I had other companies offering me work so needed to know what was happening at his end.

    Said he would definately have something to me overnight. Nothing arrived via email and no phone call. By now I've decided this guy is hard work and my focus shifted to getting paid (owes me $700) so emailed him advising that I have taken other work as I had not heard from him and when can I expect to get paid? This is Wednesday the following week....hear nothing back via email.

    Thursday I call and leave a voicemail specifically asking when the money will go through....being extremely polite but explaining I need to budget.

    I get an email Thursday night stating that the accounts lady (who has never been mentioned before) will be in on Friday and the money will go through that day. She will also email me a confirmation of transaction...they have my account details on the invoice.

    Saturday I check. No money. Email him first thing Monday asking whats happening as the money was not there. Get a prompt reply at 8.30am explaining that payments were made on Friday however it could take an extra day for 3rd party payments to go through, he says hes going through it now and will get back to me ASAP. I do not hear back from him that day (yesterday).

    First thing this morning I let him know the money has not gone through, and that I have not heard anything from the 'accounts dept' via correspondence, so can only assume it was not paid last Friday.

    Get an email back this morning saying he was assured payments had been made and that he was going through online receipts now. That was at 8.30am....I have not heard from him since.

    I sent him an email tonight requesting to come up personaly tomorrow and pick up a cheque.

    Now I'm 90% sure this guy is spinning me BS hoping I will just go away...its evident in his lack of effort to get back to me, but I'm involved so what do you think?

    I feel a small claims law suit coming on as I'm not going to drop it.
  2. Maybe you can ask for the name of the "accounts" person and speak to them?

    in any case your email conversation will see you right in any small claims case.

    Businesses may prefer to pay their bills monthly so you might have to wait a bit longer, and yes sometimes 3rd party payments can take a day or 2 to go thru.
    ie. They pay on fri (but after, say, 5pm) transaction gets queued til monday goes to your bank monday night is cleared on tuesday and visable on wed.
    Doesn't always happen that way but I think it can.

    You could ring your bank and see if there is a transaction from him that hasn't cleared yet.
  3. If he missed payment on Friday, and they did it late (after 3.30pm) on Monday, then expect the funds on Wednesday.

    If they are not there, then you better have plenty of KY handy coz you are OWNED :(
  4. Dontronics have an interesting way of handling recalcitrant debtors like this guy: - they put up all correspondence and notes on a web page, so anyone doing a google of the company will find out about their payment history.
  5. Maybe the web page option is something you can mention to them if they keep jerking you around...
  6. Yeah I'll see how it plays out for the rest of the week...as you say I have a solid email conversation right from the point of requesting references and negeotiating fees.

    Payment might well be in the pipeline but what bothers me about this guy is nothing he has said to date has happened when he said it would....I've met people like this before and they generally amount to not much as far as their word goes :roll:

    If he'ld told me upfront it would be two weeks until payment that would have been fine, but he didn't, and now I'm getting dicked about :evil:
  7. Two things (been in similar situations myself). Get the confirmation number and back and ring them up to track it. It might be there tomorrow, might be in somebody else's account.

    Still no payment after that? They're using your graphics without payment, sounds like copyright infringment. Sue them for it, for your time plus costs to recover said payment.

    If that doesn't spur them into action google may help you find ways to make accidents happen :grin:
  8. Hey you can always fly a couple of us up to Gosford to recover your debt :)
  9. If the work has been invoiced, then it belongs to the other guy, whether it is paid or not.

    That's why when one company falls over, they can take others with them, as they have supplied goods and services for which they will not be paid.

    The real bad con artists will push everybody to deliver stuff before the end of a month, then go broke on the 1st of the following month. It gives the liquidator items to sell off to pay their debts for them.
  10. This guys doing a charity bicycle ride across Australia from Perth to Sydney in July with media coverage (suposedly) so I'm a bit surprised he's messing me about. :?
  11. The bloke might be having some temporary cash flow problems hence the evasiveness but he seems to be making a bit of an effort and its not that long since you did the work so there might be others further up the line......being the optomist I'd be leaning towards you getting the payment just not straight away.

    I'd only start freaking out at the 30-60day stage.
  12. My parents own their own business and occasionaly use debt collectors to recover money when its pretty much a sure thing that the payment is never going to be made.

    1. You lose 40% upfront.
    2. I think there is a minimum amt of which im not sure.
    3. It will give the company your collecting from a bad credit rating, usually if you take this road they already have one any way.

    Its a last resort thing, but something to consider if the time frame starts to blow out.
    Sometimes if you mention it to the company they 'somehow' find the $$$ to pay you as well.

    Not a great option, but if it starts to look real iffy it might be worth looking into.

  13. Maybe he's preocupied?

    You will encounter many people who say shit and take ages to action it.
    Sadly, you're probably not his number one priority right now.
  14. There is a good chance you're being fcuked around. Explain that as a buisess person yourself you understand the occaisional cash flow problem and that if he is simply unable to pay, you can wait a week or so. The main thing is that you know when the money's comming and set a date (be firm and assertive but couteous). If it doesn't come on that date, start legal processes to recover the money without any further discussion. Keep all e-mails from him as they prove he does in fact owe you the money.

    This way, you've given him more than a fair chance before showing him that you will also not tollerate being fcuked around about it.
  15. Stick with the picking up a cheque option - NEVER EVER offer any useless threats of bad press etc, it will only work against you. Never let up, ring tthe buggar twice a day until he pays. Tell everyone who answers the phone your story, he will pay.

    One of my mates is a mechanic and he worked aa week casual for another mechanic. On Friday night at 5pm the boss said, shit i aint got any moeny to pay, will have to wait until next week. My mate (Ad) jacked up the bossses car and took his mags and put them in his car and said you can TRY an take them from now and winner takes all, or you can have them back wwhen you have my money - he was paid later that evening.
  16. Only $700? I've got a client owing $3500. Think I'll follow up that one, even though I've got a fulltime job now. Hmmmmm bike money.
  17. Right this pr1ck is definately giving me the runaround :evil: this was confirmed a couple of emails back when he said "cheques in the post as of yesterday"...the thing is I never gave him my address!

    When I queried him on it he said he'ld have to look into it and call me back in 20 mins....didn't call back. [what a surprise]

    Talked to one of the girls working there today and she's getting stuffed around with pay as well, and she's supposed to be a fulltime employee/contracter :(

    The guy has the audacity to tell her that "we are having trouble getting paid our salary too" and trying to blame the bank :LOL:

    Apparently the accounts payable girl has left too....probably didn't pay her either :roll:

    So, hi ho hi ho its off to court we go :wink:
  18. Good luck with it. :grin:

    Make the bastard pay his dues. :twisted: :LOL:
  19. Take it to Small Claims Tribunal.. Dont know about Syd, but Melb its
    about $30 to get a hearing.

    I paid a company in Adelaide $3000 for bike by direct deposit


    & the pricks refused to give me my bike AND then refuse to refund my

    1st action was to send a letter of demand.

    Then got Consumer Affairs to investigate who made a finding against
    them which I was to use as part of evidence.

    Paid the $30 for a hearing, which they wouldve had 2 travel to melb
    to attend (as youre not allowed legal representation).

    24hrs before we're due in court their lawyer sends me an urgent fax
    saying that if i discontinue legal action, the money would be deposited
    back into a/c within 7 days

    The Tribunal put a 'hold' on the hearing just in case the pricks didnt pay
  20. yeah I'm heading down that path and will be picking up the forms from the small claims court tomorrow.

    Because this guys so dodgy, been lying to me through his teeth, I'm debating whether or not to skip the letter of demand and go straight to the filing of suit.

    What do you think?

    Btw, what a wanky story about the bike :mad: what the hell did they say when you asked them about where the bike was, and the refund?