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Newspaper poll re comouflaged police

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' at netrider.net.au started by K8, Apr 4, 2008.

  1. This poll is whether police should be allowed to camouflage themselves to nab riders


    If this is posted in wrong forum , sorry , could you move and not delete.
  2. Moved to Politics, Law and Government, sorry I can't edit the thread title :(.
  3. The wording of the options does a good job at predisposing people to want to click "Yes". :-s
  4. The poll is 50/50 atm.

    I wonder how many of those ****s would have voted yes if the question stated "drivers".
  5. Well, "Road users".

    Better yet, write it to be properly impartial and say:

    (a) yes, use camouflaged police to catch speeding motorists
    (b) no, they should use stronger visual presence instead
  6. Man, modern journalism disgusts me.

    Firstly, that's asking people to believe that the police won't be out pinging people in trucks or cars.

    Secondly, they're talking about making the roads safer. While it's not totally impossible for a bike rider to injure others if they come off, we're talking about low trafficked roads with no bordering properties or population. If a rider comes down, the chances of hurting anyone but themselves is incredibly remote next to the vast issues of people failing to give way, inattentive driving, or wandering all over the road as occurs far more often on such roads than any real issue with a few bikes allegedly speeding.

    It's not making the roads safer. Once again the idiot bow gets drawn equating slowing down a few people in a straight line and equating that with having any significant impact on road safety.

    Everyone who drives or rides through that area knows full well that the odds of getting injured by a motorbike absolutely pales in comparison to the dangers of trucks and wandering cars coming head on into your lane.
  7. Allegedly :---) :rofl: Some still don't ge the faster you go, the more you will hurt if you stack.

    But seriously, the actions of a select and stupid few cause the majority to be painted with the same brush. For police to resort to such tactics to catch these few, perhaps it's these riders we should be directing our anger towards?

    It seems to always be the case that minority groups get the most attention whether by desire or not.
  8. FFS Hubie, if that's the case then that's the decision that we as adults make. The issue here is that you bunch of revenue raising cops are saying that pinging riders is making the roads safer for others, which is bullshit. It's about money. Always has and always will be. If you really wanted to make the roads safer you'd be focusing on bad roadcraft from ALL roadusers and not a minority group.

    F**k I hate this Nanny State.
  9. I agree!!!!!

    It is always about raising money. Fine for this, fine for that yadda yadda yadda.

    Get out of the Donut shops and do some real proactive policing and really get the road toll down.

    Hiding in the bushes is for cops that were too chicken shit to sign up for the army.

    When was the last time you saw a speeding motorist speed past a cop car?
    No? never? Didn't think so.

    It's far easier to fill the road network with robots that take photos of cars traveling at 5km/h over the limit at midnight with no one around.
    $138, 1 point, thanks very much.

    At least now I am safer when I drive around with my eyes glued to the speedo as opposed to the road to ensure I stay under the greed limit.

    fcuken wankers!!!!!!!
  10. Oh, so all speed detection devices are 100% accurate, are they? Yes, I know that legislation says that they are, but that's just a furphy. Everyone knows that they are not infallible, so yes, allegedly. There are guys who were picked up in the operation who swear that they were not exceeding the speed limit. In any event, yes, it is still an alleged offence until the matter is resolved either through paying the fine, or fighting it in the courts, unless of course what you're really admitting to is that it's all just a sham and there is absolutely no legal recourse.

    No - what is seriously stupid is where the police set themselves up. The first operational target on the Black Spur was a steep downhill sloping straight that is the first safe location to overtake slower moving vehicles within about 2kms of corners before that point.

    The police could not have picked a single better spot to ping people for either picking up a bit too much speed down the hill, or when moving to overtake and gathering a bit of added speed due to gravitational assistance.

    There were a number of people who were pinged for "speeding", when all they were doing was safely overtaking a slower moving vehicle on the first safe and reasonable overtaking location.

    That's just freaking bullshit policing - and to think that they then crow about their "successes" in dealing with the hoons.

    The vast, vast majority of accidents on those roads occur at well below the posted speed limits and in the corners, and yet what do the police do? Set themselves up on the most convenient straights where people will easily pick up a bit of speed to overtake.

    That's not saving anyone's lives. That's just bullshit revenue raising.
  11. I used to respect the police because they have a prick of a job to do.

    Now I just detest the pricks.

    I have friends that are DSS's in the homicide squad and major fraud and they reckon that TMU cops are the most pitifull humans that ever walked the planet.

    I was pulled over for straight lining a roundabout and issued with a fine for failing to stay in a lane or some shit.

    The cop accused me of failing to check the roundabout and didn't much like it when I stated that I did check it, called me a dickhead on numerous occasions. Asked if I knew what they did with dickheads? then stated that they pull them over and issue them with tickets.

    Well congratulations to you!!!!

    What a fine example.

    Come to think about it......I think I'll write a complaint about the fcuken arsehole!! :mad:
  12. Is it just me or has anyone else found that since the police has shifted most of their focus and resources to catching speeding drivers, people have become worse drivers?

    Didn't Christine Nixon receive some poll results or statistics recently where the most common complaint was police wasting time and resources on catching minor traffic offenders instead of persuing actual criminals?

    When the police force has the time, resources and effort to setup covert traps you know something is not right within the force. Their target needs to be moved from ordinary citizens to that group of people whose lives are based on committing crimes.

    I don't know if Hubie will comment but I am curious whether police officers are becoming increasingly frustrated on the focus put on catching minor traffic offenders instead of more proactive policing?

  13. Exactly!!!!

    When was the last time we heard about the government tippping in millions of dollars to catch violent offenders, rapists and thieves?. Police are there to uphold the law but surely there needs to be priorities, in comparison with some of the crimes being commited everyday across the country speeding is inconsequential...except for some reason it gets a hell of a lot of funding, perhaps because the more cameras we deploy the more we make...great way to watch the $$$ roll in but not so good for preventing or solving crimes that involve real victims!

    Motorists are such a good target though..at some point in their lives everybody has exceeded the limit...

    The things that really annoy me about the system as it stands are:

    1) Your guilty and you have to prove your innocence...(I don't care what the offence you sould be INNOCENT until it is proven you are guilty)

    2) Even if you are innocent the odds are stacked against you...after all who's going to beleive you the unqualified motorcycle riding/ car driving cretin over our honest police officer with his 100% accurate speed measuring device...who of course would never do anything untoward and follows the guidelines set out by the police when using his speed measuring device.

    3) To take a $150 speeding fine to court could cost you thousands for a lawyer, independant expert, time off work and other expenses...hence most people cop it sweeet....

    4) Of course you could try and defend yourself however he media beatup relating speeding to any kind of road deaths pretty much ensures your going to be found guilty anyway...unless you get off on some technicality.

    I speed (when I judge it safe to do do) and I vote and I guarantee that any political party that adresses this issue and comes up with a common sense policy that has safe motoring as it's priority rather than a knee jerk revenue raising one has my vote, sadly the brain washed masses and the sensationalist media will howl is protest and the political party will cave in...

    What a sad world we live in where vocal minority groups with a vested interest be it financial or otherwise have hijacked road safety and have foisted their flawed idea's of whats safe on us.
  14. :evil: Who the fcuk do they think they are dealing with?? It's like they cannot distinguish between a motorists and criminals. What gives them the right to talk to us like we are pieces of shit.
    Pisses me off ....
    We do have the right to demand their name, ID etc ... May be an idea to have our phones on voice record whenever we get pulled up.
    :evil: :evil:
  15. Flux et al, you're all correct. But there have been overt operations in this area and they haven't achieved anything.

    They floated the idea last year of lowering the speed limit so we knew what their intentions were.

    I too am not happy at the placement of camera's and police. I know that section you refer to and if the car drivers drove at a sensible pace and stayed at that it'd still be easy to overtake without going over 100. Unfortunately the worst ones do 40 round the corners and then promptly speed up on the straight. I hate the idea of crawling past cars at 100kmh, all the time of the wrong side of the road.

    Educating drivers about 'Slow - that means YOU' pull in locations might make life easier and safer for everyone. But that won't happen.

    I presume that they're responding to direct complaints and the very obvious accidents that they know happen up there. They tried overt operations. They run marked and unmarked vehicles. They've done random stops, checked licences and bikes. They've provided advance notice of blitzes and crackdowns and we have the GOR as an example of what would happen. Why are we surprised?

    There intent is to make the road and the location unattractive for people to centralise on, just like the GOR.
  16. "When was the last time we heard about the government tippping in millions of dollars to catch violent offenders"

  17. Yeah, we really do live in a sad state of affairs. It's totally unreasonable that you can't go at the speed you want when you want and endanger yourself and others. Total injustice!

    Yes there are sections of many roads where travelling over the posted speed limit would be safe however, even if you yourself are capable, the person behind you, next to you, infront of you or coming from the opposite direction cannot be trusted to be as good a driver/rider. I've lost count of the amount of times people here comment on 'cagers' doing stupid things around riders. This is exactly why there are rules and we should be doing our level best to anticipate such behaviour. And those who say I speed when I judge it to be safe are the ones I worry about.

    As far as attitude from police is concerned, it is unacceptable to be treated in such a manner as Vic has stated. I speak to all people I deal with in a professional manner and usually get a 'thank you' even when I book them. If the driver decides to lower the conversation in the gutter, I may follow, but only if this is what gets the message through.

    I chose to be in a traffic office. We have a total of 12 members, and there are always people on days off, leave and so on. The CIU in my area number around 40 so don't try and tell me that money is not poured into crime fighting and it's all tipped into traffic. The number of traffic police has reduced in the last few years, not increased.

    Speed is only one of the things that are targeted. Poor driving behaviour is targeted but as with speed cameras, people slow down for them until they are out of range. How many people will exhibit poor driving habits in plain view of police unless they are the worst offenders or just totally crap drivers?

    Walk a day in my shoes. I don't care if alot of you don't like traffic cops, we are the most hated of police becuase we give people things they don't want. Water off a ducks back for me. I'm only going to stop someone if they've done something wrong that I think requires dealing with. And I'll treat you like any normal person unless you decide not to do the same to me.
  18. Yes, exactly. Because Speed Cameras are in place instead. If there were more of you out there being visible and catching bad drivers (not headchecking, not indicating, tailgating etc etc etc ) rather than speed cameras catching people doing 3k's over the limit we'd all be better off!

    My God Hubie, do you deliberately ignore what we're saying?! It's not and has never been about going at whatever speed you want!!! Go back and reread some of the threads around here. I'm not going into it again.
  19. You must have different information than me Dougz. The number of speed cameras has nothing to do with the number of traffic police. Speed cameras are controlled by the government and their budget is separate from that of the police budget.

    Force command controls what money goes where within the police force.

    Yes I've read pleny of threads since I joined this forum and I'm constantly ammused at the attitude of some who believe they can do what they want, when they want becuase they can do it 'safely'. maybe you should re read some of these threads yourself.

    If you're sick of all these really harsh rules that we have there are a few choices. Do a track day, maybe even stick within the rules, or at least be prepared to cop it (pardon the pun) when you get caught. Or you can always move to a country where we don't have all these harsh and unreasonable rules taking away our liberty. I'm sure you'll be much safer there and have a higher standard of living too!

    We live in a pretty damn good country I reckon, why do you think so many emmigrate here?
  20. As senior police have openly admitted, that drivers behave themselves when there is police presence. Doesn't this mean that more presence is required to make it safer, than the current way of thinking which is maximizing the fines return? A speed camera doesn't stop anyone from speeding..it just returns a fine.

    I do believe that if drivers were fined for all the little things (that don't seem to matter), like stopping over the stop line, failing to stay in the lane, failure to indicate early enough, tailgating etc...then they would be more consious of other stuff. like the running red lights, speeding, head checking etc.

    Because the minor things are not enforced it leads one to believe that it doesn't matter. If the minor things are taken care of then the major things will look after themselves.

    We need to encourage alert drivers, not creating angry ones as that seems to be happening now.

    Oh keep up the good work.