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New LAMS bike

Discussion in 'Bike Reviews, Questions and Suggestions' started by phat_dogg, Sep 1, 2010.

  1. Hey all,

    I've recently got my P's and i want to upgrade from my Honda CBF250 to something a little bigger. Being under 25, I will need to be on my P's for the next 3 years. I know everyone says buy a cheap used bike until i get on my full licence but 3 years is a long time for me to wait.

    I was just wondering if i could get any advice on the following bikes i am interested in.

    Kawasaki Ninja 650rl & Yamaha FZ6r. Both these bikes would be new.
    I also like the Ducati Monster 620. It would obviously be used since the lams versions dont come out new anymore. How does this bike compare to the other two?

    Also, with the throttle restrictors, does it just mean that the throttle does not twist back all the way and the bike can still eventually rev to redline or is there a rev cut off as well?

    Advice will be much appreciated.

    Thanks :)
  2. I haven't ridden any of those, but the Ducati will be more expensive to maintain. Maybe not by a lot...

    They'll all keep you relatively satisfied in terms of power, & from what I understand, the Ducati & FZ6R have restricted throttles (could be wrong, do some research), which limit the throttle opening & subsequently the RPM.

    The good thing about that system is that you can bypass it easily when you get more experienced, & as long as you don't tell your local RTA, can be reverted back to LAMS legal.

    If you do tell them you've modified it, it can never be returned to LAMS legal.

    Also, if you crash, you may run into insurance problems.
  3. Ditto what MV just said.

    You can always weigh up other options as well - I would highly recommend getting a secondhand bike to use, as buying a LAMS bike may seem like a great idea but I can't imagine myself being 'limited' to that bike afterwards as well, even with the extra power. They also tend to be fairly pricey for the bike they are, and you'll lose a reasonable amount on depreciation.

    Have you considered options like the Suzuki GS500? Or are you really after a new machine?

    Cheers - boingk
  4. Well... The real thing is how big your budget is. New bikes are going to incur a large hike in your insurance...

    I can't really offer any specific advice on what bike to get though. I'm living the very same LAMS nightmare as you.
  5. I'd honestly prefer a used bike over something new. I'm just a sucker for looks, and the GS500 doesn't really do it for me. Ridden a mate's GS500F though and great all round bike. If i weren't restricted to a LAMS bike, i'd pay 15k for some of the used bikes on the market right now.

    I don't mind spending 11-12k for a new lams bike cause the way i see it, when i decide to sell it in 3 years and just say i get 7.5k for it, i've spent a bit over 1k a year to have the bike i actually want rather than having something that im not too fond of for the whole 3 years
  6. I have a GSX650FU, and its a great bike. There is a crapload of second hand ones coming onto the market right now as they were released a little over a year ago and I expect many of them were picked up by people like me with only a year of P1s to do. I see bikes listed from 7500 up to 8500 second hand so I think they're great value.

    As far as the LAMS restriction is concerned, forget about it. Its a non issue.

    One month to go, and I'll be selling mine, if you're interested and in the area.
  7. If it gets stolen or written off, you drop the lot though.

    How about the CB400?

    Throttle restricted bikes sound really lame.

    Or do what this fellow on another forum did
  8. the LAMS restrictions are hardly restrictions if you can put up with uncomfy bikes that like to wheelstand all the time and lots of maintenance.
  9. Yeah, the only issue with that is insurance; crash it, and they look at the bike and then decide to deny your claim due to the fact that the bike has been illegally modified.

    One of the restrictions of the LAMS certification is that the bike may not be modified in any way.
  10. Thanks for the advice guys, i am not looking for more power at the moment...still much more to learn. Right now i just want a bigger bike with more torque so i can ride around more comfortably. Nobody has answered me yet about whether the bike can still reach redline with the throttle restrictor. Does anybody know? Thanks
  11. Read that again.
  12. Are you sure? My understanding is that modified LAMs bikes are perfectly legal to ride on a full licence, if he is keeping the bike after his restriction expires.. Just advise the insurance company.
  13. I'd be very surprised if they don't it reach redline in neutral and first. Top gear of course is a different question.
  14. The throttle cable itself is restricted, how far it is restricted will depend on how many RPM how can achieve.

    It is a direct relationship between throttle opening & RPM, ie, 50% throttle restriction, 50% available RPM.

    A software based restriction could be completely different of course; it could be set to give full power in first gear, & subsequently less in each gear, for example, but you would need fuel injection & an ECU.

    Where did you get the "after restrictions" part from?

    If you modified the throttle stop while still on LAMS, you have illegally modified the bike so that it no longer complies with the LAMS criteria, which COULD be reason for your insurance to not pay.
  15. I was disagreeing with the term "illegal". It's not an illegal modification, but the bike isn't LAMs after any modification to improve power to weight. Otherwise all those people who bore out their Sachs Madasses and CT110's would have to re-register their bikes.

    Also, there isn't a direct relationship between throttle opening and rpm under varying load. If I open the throttle of my bike halfway when the bike's in neutral or first, the bike will bounce off the redline. However, if I do the same in top gear, I won't be able to get anywhere near the redline.
  16. The illegal part only applies to bikes that have been restricted to meet LAMS approval, ie the Hyosung 650.

    I also doubt anyone has been able to get more than 150kw/tonne out of a CT110 engine, so it's a moot point.

    Discounting varying loads, it's direct.

    What type of bike do you have? I4? I have a twin, so our experiences could be different.

    Pretty sure my bike won't, usually if it's half throttle, it's 50% rpm, discounting overrun etc. I'll give it a try on my commute home.

    Either way, if we discount neutral & possibly even first, no you won't see redline on a restricted bike.

  17. Thanks for that, makes sense now. I should have made it a little clearer. I just wanted to know if there was a rev limiter such as the one at redline but earlier in the rpm range. I know that the bike with only half throttle wouldnt be powerful enough to get to the upper range of the revs in higher gears.
  18. I work in a position that entitles me to ride most of the new bikes as they come out. I absolutely cant stand the big lams bikes in general such as the ninja 650 and suzuki 650 equivilant. They only give you about a third turn on the throttle before you hit the stop which is annoying and i believe teaches bad habbits as you dont get proper feel for throttle control. On the other hand bikes like the cb400 are bloody brilliant as they are mot "restricted" in any way they just happen to fall into the right power to weight ratio. What does this mean? Plenty of rev happy learner legal power without the throttle restriction or feeling like the bikes all choked up. Ive never ridden the new learner legal fz but i imagine its no better. Stick to a gs500, cb400 or the like and get a bike that isnt neutered. Or get a 450 motard ^_^
  19. motard. you know you want to.
  20. Yeah, I've got a 636 (I4). It hits the redline with half throttle in first (roughly). As I go up through the gears however I definitely need to open the throttle wider to reach the same rpm. Actually, now that I think of it, my old Spada used to have throttle response more like what you're describing, so engine layout is probably a significant factor.

    I brought up the CT110 example because, according to VicRoads, a learner cannot ride a modded one, even though it won't exceed the 150kW/t ratio. I doubt it's enforced though.