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Let's RFID chip everybody!!!!

Discussion in 'The Pub' started by Chef, Oct 20, 2011.

  1. Well this would solve the problem of chipping vehicles, let's just chip the people instead.

    I say we start with the po-po. Vicpol have clearly demonstrated over the past couple of years how currupt they are, and they also seem open to the suggestion of chipping people. That's a fucking win/win...

    If we can't stick them in their heads, we could always stick them in the clothing...

    ....and then you're next...


  2. I've been thinking about this kinda thing ever since the "smart-card" idea came up, and I think it's inevitable really.
    But before a public would even entertain the idea, you'd have to steadily erode their civil liberties and personal freedoms over a number of years, until there was almost nothing left...

    Ohhhh shit.
  3. They keep pushing for it don't they, and they keep rebranding the idea until they can find a socially acceptable version of it. The latest one is a swipe and go debit card for purchases under $30. No PIN required.
  4. Actually, it has already gone further than that. FB offers a tracking facility to certain organisations via your mobile phone, and Google tracks and sells your browsing habits.
    They really don't need a chip, but it would streamline the process.
  5. Does the film The Island of Doctor Moreau with Marlon Brando come to mind to anyone concerning "chips"
  6. Nitekreeper your avatar says it all....


    Move along, citizen.

  7. Commuists (ohh sorry I beleive the PC term these days is "Greens) love this shit !
  8. There will be no need for any perceived "gradual erosion" All that is needed in the system is for the financial sectors to move to a cashless system. Anyone who does not move over aswell will simply be unable to survive.
  9. It's a funny thing, but something I've noticed over the years is that the political right frequently bang on about how anti-civil liberties the left are whilst, at the same time, being the most enthusiastic about eroding them. Maybe it's just a function of my having reached political maturity in Thatcher's Britain, but I've known far more genuine civil liberties activists (no, not feral rent-a-mobs) with a left leaning bent than otherwise.

    However, civil liberties are not (or should not be) an issue of left/right. Governments of any stripe like a nice, compliant population because they're easy to govern and cheap(er) to police. Those without substantial political power (and that, in reality, means everybody outside the richest 1% of the population) need to be aware of this and to be ever mindful of the creep of state control over individual behaviour.
  10. I suppose you can produce some sort of argument to backup this wildly deluded claim?

    This interests me. Given many of our transactions are already cashless, aren't we there already? I mean, all the authorities need to do is produce evidence supporting a suspicion to a magistrate and the banks cough up your records. Is it really that scary, or only that scary if you're a former representative of the health services union?

    This is a good observation. The whole "we need to get tough on crime" is historically the natural turf of the right. Something to do with property ownership. Its trading one civil liberty against other civil liberties.

    Interesting that you've raised Thatcher. She was always more neo-liberal than conservative. I imagine some of the shit she got up to would've had traditional conservatives, like Disraeli, shifting uncomfortably in their seats.
  11. I was refering more to a banks ability to control the money. In a completely cashless society, a bank would be required for the completion of any financial transaction using a currency. The banks could use financial penalties to discourage certain transactions and I have no doubt they would use it to control aspects of the market. There are already ATM companies that make their money off the $2.00 fee (don't get me started on the claims of the financial sector that regulating the price was preventing competition. Since the deregulation, I don't think I have seen a single one go down in price) What if there is no cash option though? You would either have to be a customer of a certain bank, or pay a fee. What happens if a company that is a major threat to people who have control of a bank tries to open up? The banks simply refuse to supply their system to the company.. and the company can't function or it can function... for a fee.
  12. #13 killbot88, Oct 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2015
    I think he may be listening to Monckton too much. (Jump to 1:50)

  13. The Greens are trying to repeal the Terrorism Act that is the most serious threat to our civil rights. Which was put in by the Linda.

  14. Through my father, who was a moderately senior army officer and also Deputy Lord Lieutenant of the county, I met quite a number of what might be regarded as "traditional" conservatives. Senior military, minor rural aristocracy and the like. From what I could gather, most of them had little but contempt for the mob of shysters, spivs and used-car salesmen that comprised Thatchers Tories. Didn't stop the daft buggers voting for 'em though, if only for a lack of any "centre-right with some social conscience" alternative.

    Much of the difference, in my view, was the belief/myth amongst the traditional upper classes that their position entailed responsibilities as well as conferring rights. In brief, whilst it is appropriate that the peasant should be subservient to the landholder, nonetheless the landholder has a moral obligation to act in an almost paternal role towards their subjects. Also, the very basis of inherited wealth and power revolves around being, not the owner of ones holdings, but a custodian holding them in trust for future generations.

    Please note that I do not consider this state of affairs to be "right" and also note that I did use the term "myth", but the power of a longstanding and pervasive myth to moderate behaviour should not be underestimated.

    Regardless, I generally found the "old money" to be a whole lot more palatable than the nouveau riche.

    It should also be noted that the (unelected and so, nominally, undemocratic) House of Lords acted, on occasion, to moderate the loopier right wing behaviour of the Thatcher government when an impotent cetre-left opposition couldn't. I still remember a then very old Harold MacMillan (former Tory PM) speaking most scathingly of government policy.
  15. With all this talk, chipping people etc. I see it all looking like a Si-Fi movie!!!
    But then again, ever noticed that todays Science Fiction is tomorrows Science Fact???
    Flip phones - Star Trek, 40 years ago!!!
    Advances in robotics
    Reliance on computers. Etc, etc, etc.
    Where will it end??? (I'll be baack!!)
  16. #17 ogden, Oct 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2015
    Sorry. I thought you meant information gathering. I can see what you're describing is a scary scenario, and if it were to happen, I can see things going that way, but I'm not sure I can the world going cashless. Cash currency is a wonderful technology because it is so simple. There more simple something is, the less that can go wrong. This is important because it has no value beyond the faith that people invest in it. The more complex something is, the more that can go wrong. This undermines faith in money as a system. Cashless forms of transaction do work, but the complexity of the technology that under-girds it, itself represents a systemic risk. I can't see any country abandoning cash money for this reason. The form of redundancy it provides is too valuable... That, and it precludes the odd car-boot sale.

    Is it just me, or did he steal his eyeballs from Kermit the frog?

    I can see the truth in what you describe about old school Tories, but I wasn't aware of the contempt and wariness they felt for the Thatcher's neo-liberal agenda. It's amazing how even quite recent history can be something you don't have a proper gasp of you've not either lived through it or studied it in depth. I can remember (just) the Falklands War being on the TV news, and of course one gets an awareness of the deep antipathy the working class left had for her, but its easy to miss these more subtle tensions, esp. from half a world away. I used to think it was all about Humphrey Appleby and Bernard discussing subtle points of Greek and Latin grammar in the company of their uncomprehending minister.
  17. http://www.markbeast.com/mark/mark-beast-verichip.htm
  18. Thanks for the education fellas - I remember the Falklands too, remember Maggie on the TV, and I remember a bloke called Arthur Scargill wreaking havoc around the same time.
    Sadly however, most of it has been reduced to soundbites in Roger Waters songs in my mind, so it's nice to hear from Pat and Ogden...
  19. One, two, three four, five. Last two are of least importance. And don't use Facebook on your phone (I've even uninstalled the application, as I'm simply not going to use it).