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VIC "If you don't like this, stop riding motorcycles"

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' started by Deadsy, Jun 25, 2012.

  1. http://www.nenews.com.au/stories.aspx?pub=ch&day=Fri&class=Stories&type=SINGLE&path=XML/&rec=05

    Read what he has to say in this transcript from the Victorian Parliamentary Inquiry into Motorcycling Safety: http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/im...ipts/20111129_VicPolWangaratta_Transcript.pdf

    He wants atgatt and fluoro laws but cannot quantify how many accidents he comes across in which the rider is not wearing gear. He thinks filtering should be illegal, even though it is something he is trained to do and wants front number plates. My favourite part is when he describes motorcycles as "the bane of his existence".

    So I'm going to start reading some of this thread now: https://netrider.net.au/forums/showthread.php?t=122675&page=18 But is this all the babbling of a guy who wants people to pay attention to him because he has wasted 35 years of his life or is there more to it?

  2. Me thinks he full of shit. Unless we adopt the european standards, there won't be any standards to tie such legislation to; and there are some barriers to us adopting the euro standards anyway (ie summer).

    I believe TAC is running with a project to develop standards for motorcycle gear; that might ultimately result in mandated ATGATT. Can't see it happening any time soon though.
  3. Let them try. How enforceable is it? How often do they even check helmets for compliance?
  4. and when it's proven that flouro does precisely fuckall for safety, what then?
  5. There was a study out of Hawaii that appears to link high conspicuity (hi vis vests, bright coloured bikes) with a lower incidence of incidents. Bloody hard to draw any meaningful conclusions tho IMO, since AFAIK the stats were based on the representation of different colours in the sample group of bikes that had accidents, without taking into account all the bikes that didn't crash. :-/
  6. Speaking of fluoro:

    Appeal against sentence and length of licence disqualification - defendant and appellant convicted of aggravated driving without due care -
    defendant sentenced to imprisonment for eight months - seven months of term suspended on defendant entering good behaviour bond -
    one month of term to be served in prison - Magistrate disqualified defendant from holding or obtaining driver’s licence for 18 months -
    whether defendant's conduct close to being in the worst offending category - whether sentencing discretion of Magistrate miscarried.

    Held: appeal allowed - good reason to suspend term of imprisonment - order of Magistrate partially suspending defendant's sentence set aside -
    sentence of eight months imprisonment wholly suspended on defendant agreeing to enter into good behaviour bond for two years -
    terms of licence disqualification unaltered.

    The facts that lie behind this sentence appeal demonstrate the dangers in everyday road-use. A motorcyclist, travelling within the law, on a clear, dry morning on a country road, died as a result of a collision with a motor vehicle at an intersection. The driver of the motor vehicle was travelling at an appropriate speed, was aware of the give-way sign, slowed down and looked out both to the left and to the right, but failed to see the motorcyclist. There was an explanation. The motorcyclist was wearing black, was riding a black motorcycle and was travelling against a background of dark trees which cast a shadow, partially obscuring and camouflaging the motorcyclist.

    This was a tragedy. The motorcyclist’s loved ones have lost a husband, a father, a grandfather and uncle. The driver is married. She and her husband have three children aged from four and a half years to seven months. She is a good mother, wife and an upright citizen who is an outstanding contributor to her rural community. Is the driver’s want of care any more than the everyday experience of a motorist looking but not seeing what is there? Is this the case that calls for the driver to be “locked away”, the subject of an immediate term of imprisonment, or is there a more appropriate approach that may be taken?

    Defence counsel informed the court that the defendant had lived on a farming property on Thiele Road for more than eight years and she traversed the intersection on almost a daily basis. On the day in question, as the defendant approached the intersection on Thiele Road, travelling east, she slowed and looked to the left and right. She saw no other traffic. She then proceeded to cross the intersection. The defendant was travelling slowly, both in her approach to the intersection and when she proceeded to cross it. The defendant did not see the motorcyclist at all. An explanation was proffered. The motorcyclist was dressed in black and was riding a black motorcycle. Counsel for the defendant submitted that as a consequence, the motorcycle and its rider were camouflaged and obscured against the backdrop of the pine-trees and their shadow to the north-east of the intersection.

    The force of the impact caused the defendant’s vehicle to roll several times. The defendant went to the motorcyclist, saw that he was seriously injured and told him that help would be on its way. One of her children had been thrown from her vehicle and was unconscious nearby. Her youngest child was in a baby capsule, but apart from some minor glass cuts, was uninjured.

    The defendant was genuinely and deeply remorseful for causing the collision and the motorcyclist’s death. The defendant in open court apologised to the family of the deceased in the following terms:

    "I make no attempt to say that I understand what Mr Bryant’s family has gone through but I know that there is no penalty that the court can
    impose that can bring him back. For this I am truly sorry. I can only imagine the loss they have endured and hope that the penalty imposed
    and the impact it will have on my life will give the family some sense of justice. "

    It is well settled that a sentence of immediate imprisonment is a sentence of last resort. As the Magistrate observed, the defendant in every respect, was a prime candidate for a suspended sentence. Her general reputation attested to her good character. She is a hard working, dedicated mother of a young family. She participates in her community. This is not the case of a hoon driver, or an irresponsible or daredevil driver. This is not the case of a selfish driver insensitive to the rights of other road users.

    The evidence of the defendant’s contrition and remorse is significant. Her poor mental health for a lengthy period following the collision evidences her guilt and remorse. The fact that the defendant did not drive because of fear, and her consequent social isolation are further evidence of the above matters. Her apology given in court is evidence of her obvious and acute awareness of the suffering that she has caused the loved ones of the deceased.

    In my view, there is good reason to suspend the term of imprisonment.

    The Magistrate appears to have misunderstood the reduction that should be made following an early plea of guilty. However, in the circumstances of this case, I do not propose to interfere with the head sentence, nor do I propose to interfere with the licence disqualification.

    The defendant has suffered personally and is subject to an imprisonment order of eight months. It is only suspended because her personal circumstances give rise to good reason to suspend, thereby enlivening my discretion. In these circumstances, the term of imprisonment for eight months should be suspended.


    Having regard to the foregoing, I would allow the appeal for the limited purpose of setting aside the order made by the Magistrate pursuant to section 38(2a) of the Sentencing Act, partially suspending the defendant’s sentence. I am prepared to make an order suspending the sentence of eight months imprisonment. This is subject to the defendant agreeing to enter into a two-year good behaviour bond.

    Link: Thiele v Police (2009) Supreme Court of South Australia.

  7. Is that the same lady who, a few years prior to the motorcycle, also failed to give way to a car and killed another person? At exactly the same intersection.

    Was the motorcycle's headlight working? Maybe he had one of those black light bulbs? If it is the same person, maybe cars should be fluoro too?


    It is the same person, what a ****ing joke.

    Fluoro eh? ](*,)
  8. I don't think they'd see us if we danced naked on the seats half the time. Fluro jackets isn't going to achieve much. Why do we have to keep suffering the consequences because people can't drive properly?
    • Like Like x 4
  9. Typical country copper sort of stuff - making brash and broad statements without really understanding what is going on.

    He makes the following comment
    Ironically a few months ago with the introduction of the new crappy TAC ad, the TAC head made a similar sort of comment.

    It tends to highlight their ignorance towards the motorcycle community as well as the reason they don't get any respect. If you antagonise the groups you are trying to persuade, well that is just silly.

    Either way, uninformed inflammatory comments from official representatives don't help anyone. It does however give us an insight into how they view us - or confirmation as it may be.

    Disappointing really that they are such amateurs that they couldn't persuade a pig to roll in mud.
  10. my headlight is way brighter than a fluro vest.

    if they can't see that, they would'nt see the vest behind it.
    • Like Like x 8
  11. about fluro shit, the TAC should talk to bus drivers about that, if you don't see a bus, you won't see a motorcycle who is fluro.
    • Like Like x 1
  12. How about I'll keep riding, and this fuckwit stops being a copper?
    I've been going through those submissions over the last couple of days and the scary thing is, this isn't the most ridiculous...
    • Like Like x 3
  13. Or have a quick chat to any local fire-fighters.

    If people pull out in front of firetrucks while they're running lights and sirens. (and they do)
    How will a fluro vest help motorcyclists exactly?

    Nothing makes you easier to see if the driver isn't fucking looking properly
  14. If they pass anything like that I will do everything in my power to waste as much taxpayer money and police resources as I can before I move… and mark my words, there will be a lot.
    • Like Like x 4
  15. It doesn't have to be enforceable, It only has to be infringeable. Just another baton in the armoury.

    You do have to wonder what the RSC will make of their decisions being made and announced in advance, but neither they, the Police Minister nor the Premier have the will or the power to stop VP getting what they want.
  16. #16 Justus, Jun 26, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2015
    It sure was.


  17. I wonder what he'd say about the incident on the corner of Spring and Collins Street last week where a police car with lights and siren going had a young woman step off the kerb in front of him - he didn't hit her but came bloody close.

    I've seen the same thing happen with ambulances and fire engines. To see, you first have to look!

    And she wasn't using a phone or an iPod either...
    • Like Like x 1
  18. I'm sure that companies like DriRider, Draggin Jeans etel would all have something to say if they mandated full leathers only.
  19. I think this is half the problem tho. They should be having something to say NOW, not after it's all gone to shit. I'm really surprised that the manufacturers aren't weighing in on this issue far more than they appear to be.

    On the other hand, now that I think about it some more, I can't see the leather part getting through, but, if fluro does, they're all in for a wind fall as thousands of MC riders are all heading off to buy new gear.
  20. Maybe the manufacturers don't know. Remember this article was in a Wangarratta paper, not exactly a widely read paper.