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Help Pls, was doing newcastle to sydney and the cibby died!

Discussion in 'Technical and Troubleshooting Torque' at netrider.net.au started by livingstonest, Mar 10, 2006.

  1. Recently i've sold my cb250 and wanted and szr or some motard but due to many difficulties i ended up buying a cbr250 bout 4 days ago. Was extremely happy with purchase because the cbr has much better handling, a revyer engine, and a loud aftermarket exhaust! Remember i'm still new so anything other than the cb250 is a s(*&load of fun to me.

    Anyway i've been riding around everynite for last 4 days and having a bloody ball! After work thursday decided to ride it down from newcastle to sydney. Was having a blast! Enjoying the handling, revy engine and thank gawd for fairings!

    Then about 40min down the freeway cruising at 90km/h i give it alittle more throttle to overtake a really slow car and the throttle doesn't respond. So i sit at 90km/h not able to overtake. Then power starts dropping on me and not responding to throttle. Oh no.....so i pull over....engine dies. Looking, checking, then i realise that its low on coolant and so put water in there for now. Temp guage was not high, it was low to middle, closer to middle.

    After awhile of trying it starts up again and off we go only this time going 300m, just enough for me to turn off the freeway at tugerah and turn left at the first round-about. There it stayed never to start again! It kinda feels like it does when its outta fuel.

    History of bike is that the previous guy bought it in june 05, put 1000km on it and never rode it again so what can happen if bike sits for long time with no running?

    Anyway special thanks to Netriders Typhoon who got me towing numbers....thanks champ! And Soarer who gave me tech advice. No thanks to all those riders who rode by looking at me.

    In the end i got it towed back and had a great chat with the tower who also rides harleys! :) And that was my little adventure for the day....even when it goes not as planned i still love these 2 wheeled experiences!



    Anybody wanna hazard a guess as to what maybe wrong?
     
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  2. Alot of info in there which helps us to help you :)

    Now some questions : you say the coolant was low , how low ?
    the last guy only did 1000k on it?
    Do you knowif the previous owner did or have you flushed the fuel system right though and changed the fuel filter ( if there is one )

    Withtout looking at it and listening too it try and turn over ATM it sound's like one of three possable problems * one cheap and easy* the others well um ( lets not go there yet )

    1: dirty /contaminated fuel / lines / carbys
    1st off drain out whats left of your fuel, and flush out the lines and carbys with good fresh fuel, change the s/plugs and spin the mtr over a few times with the plugs out ( to clear out any crap that may be in there )
    then hopefully she will start and your on the road again :)

    2: its electrical and unless you really know what your doing that a bike shop job :?

    3: if the water level was extremly low (and the guage is faulty) therefore not showing up the overheating.
    you have heat seazed the eng, and that will mean a minor topend rebuild ( rings/ piston and hone out ) at the very least.

    hope this helps you out a little

    :)
     
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  3. Did you try switching the bike to reserve? :)
     
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  4. I thought about adding that bit in, but didn't want to embarrise the poor guy


    :LOL: :p :LOL:
     
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  5. Haha, no its definitely not the fuel.....tried reserve etc, there's enough fuel in it for another 150km! I filled tank and only put little over 100km on it
     
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  6. VTRBob you champion! What you've given me allows me to start the investigation! I'll probably just put it in the shop though. But of course i wanna know what's going on. Will plan to do some kinda mechanics course later.

    Now with the overheating and seizing of the bike, if it is that then would that have caused the bike to slowly faulter like it did or i thought engine seize meant that it would lock the bike up? as if its ran outta oil?

    Also wouldn't it feel extremely hot between my legs? (no jokes pls!)
     
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  7. What is your oil level like??
     
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  8. No there is a posability that you wouldn't feel a thing ( but it is only a 250 ) and we all know size dont matter :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

    sorry couldn't help myself :cool:

    But in answer to your question yeah a mtr heat seazing can give the symptoms of running out of fuel, then when they cool down will turn over just like normal, and sometimes they will even start again :shock:
    but more often than not the ring welds itself to the piston ( or as we say *nuked* itself ) resulting in lack of compression etc .
     
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  9. No oil is fine, checked that before i left.

    I can't remember my cb250 having coolant so i didn't think about checking that before i left.....so stupid
     
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  10. battery mighyt have keeled. was it backfiring before it died?
     
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  11. No battery was fine....

    The more i read up on this the more i got a bad feeling that the engine is cactus.....coolant was low, below the line of lower.....could've been like that for awhile, i'm moron didn't check, didn't bother checking cause i saw the temp guage working........hmmm this could be bad. Also i would've thought that i would feel alot of heat from the engine which i didn't.

    Anyway live n learn i'll find out from the mechanics this wednesday
     
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  12. Doesn't the CBR run an electric fuel pump? That could be the problem right there.
     
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  13. smart thinking
     
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  14. Hey would like to know:

    Say the engine did seize due to no coolant....and the temp guage was not working.....wouldn't that mean that the engine gave off heaps and heaps of heat? Or can it go unnoticed?

    Thanks for all your help guys, appreciate it. I'll fill you guys in on wednesday when bike gets checked.
     
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  15. I don't think you cooked it. You'd notice that, lots of heat, probably steam and horrible burning oil smell. Sure, sometimes engines will restart, but they always run rougher than before the seize.
    Sounds like fuel or air starvation to me. The fact that you slowly lost power seems to point that way.
    From what you told me, and the fact the bike sat for a while, you may have stireed up sediment/water in the tank and basically, engines don't run on sediment/water! You could also have stale fuel playing havoc in teh fuel system.
    When you go to a mechanic, if the bike doesn't have a fuel filter, get one installed. They save so much hard work later. I have a see through filter on my bike, and it sat for ages before I got it. I have a nice thick layer of sediment (probably rust) in the bottom of my filter, which would be in the carbs now if not for that filter!

    Regards, Andrew.
     
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  16. I really does sound like a fuel blockage. I don't think there's any need to worry about having cooked it. Especialy if you have a working temp gauge that didn't register too hot. Easy way to tell is check that the oil looks ok. If it's going to the sop anyway, get them to clean out the fuel system and it should be fine. The new bike's not cactus by a long way. :)
     
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  17. Had a mate with a CBR250 with what sounds like a similar problem. Trouble starting it, then once we got it started, would run like a dog for maybe 500m, before stalling, and wouldn't start again.

    Turns out the problem was a combination of crud in the fuel system, and fuel pump. Fuel pump was blocked with crud, so wouldn't pump fuel.

    My advice is to clean the tank. To do that, pull it off, mostly empty it, put a short length of chain (or handful of screws, if you want to torture yourself - be sure to count how many you put in!) and shake it all about. This should break of the rust and crud inside the tank. Give it a good rinse in clean petrol.

    Then install a paper type fuel filter, and check the fuel pump works. You need to make sure the fuel pump can pump *ABOVE* the level of the tank. if you hold it below the tank fuel will run out, but this doesn't mean it's working. While you're at it, drain your float bowls (little phillips head screws at bottom of carbies) as they probably have a bit of crud in them.

    You can also run without a fuel pump if you either hold the tank up a bit higher, or make sure the tank is full.

    WIth all the starter motor cranking you'll probably at some point need to either jump start or recharge the battery.

    Hope that helps,
    Phil
     
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  18. A freind of mine's gsx750 died in similar circumstances the other week.

    The only thing I could find wrong with it was the fuel line was a little loose on the tap. Not enough to starve the engine in itself.

    I put it back on properly and it fixed it.

    I theorised that air must have been getting back up the fuel line and because the tap relies on vacuum the tap closed and starved tthe engine of fuel.

    So check all fuel and vacuum lines (the cleaning advice above is good).

    I doubt you siezed the engine. These modern engines stand up to some pretty nasty treatment. Have a smell and look at the oil. If it's not too bad and it's turning over then it should be fine. A compression test will confirm or deny.

    Oh and on a side note, a mate of mine who runs a radiator workshop told me that once a temperature gauge is out of the water, they don't work. So don't use that as a measure of whether it overheated or not.
     
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  19. Hey dude, what's teh latest on teh bike?
    The temperature gauge tip is a good one. You should watch all gauges for changes, and even the cool side of the temp gauge can signal trouble. If your gauge is hot, then suddenly drops, check it NOW!

    Regards, Andrew.
     
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  20. Hey Guys,
    another tip from having done it my self,

    Check the fuel lines from the tank to the tap,
    to see if they are around the right way,
    had an FZR250RR similar symptoms.

    The fuel lines where reversed,

    When the tap was in the ON position,
    it was really running on the tanks reserve,
    constantly draining all the crap out of the bottom of the tank,
    result,
    Clean tank,
    blocked fuel pump.
    dirty carbs and no power,
    not to meantion running out of fuel,
    switching the tap over and finding the tank is dry.

    Cheers
    Chris.
     
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