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QLD Fined twice for same offence

Discussion in 'Politics, Laws, Government & Insurance' at netrider.net.au started by sahig131, Aug 2, 2014.

  1. So, about a month ago I was heading home after an exam, minding my own buisness when I see flashing lights behind me. I pull over, like a good boy, and cop a ticket for 22+ over from a motorbike cop. Fair enough, I was speeding. Paid the fine, and put it behind me- or so I thought.

    Until in the mail this week I got a photographic detection speeding infringement notice in the mail for the same day, time, road and speed: just a couple hundred meters before the motorbike cop was sitting with his radar gun...



    So what are my options???

    camera.
     
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  2. I'd be fighting it. Send a letter in to the issuer of the infringement, with a copy of your other ticket. Common sense says you cant get pinged for the same offence within a k or 2. But then this is law, not common sense.
     
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  3. Be interesting to here what happens with this,double jeopardy or just another taxing lesson.
     
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  4. Phew, alright Ill take it in to QLD transport and see if I can get it sorted. Thanks guys, I'll keep you posted.

    Out of interest, what it the relevant legislation/laws/acts (not a law student) in regards to two fines in the same area/time?
     
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  5. The source of information you are after should be in the Traffic Manual Queensland Police Service (Issue 23) which is available to the public on the QPS website.

    Maybe have a look at Chapter 8 - Infringement Notices.

    Justus.
     
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  6. Ignore QLD transport, you need to talk to qpolice traffic camera office. They have issued the TIN and only they can withdraw it.
     
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  7. Thanks Justus and TWEET, I've just mailed off a letter to the traffic camera office, hopefully it gets sorted.

    There was a time difference of around 5ish minutes between the time on the speed camera ticket and the time the officer wrote on the second ticket - more than accounted for by the time taken to pull me over (time waiting at a red light, pulling into side street, parking, taking off my gear, finding my licence and chating to the cop before he wrote the ticket).

    Hopefully this wont be an issue.
     
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  8. Many times travelling between SYD and BNE I have noticed HWP sitting within 500m or so of Speed Cameras. Not sure of the ruling in NSW, but as it is the Tax State / Nanny State wouldn't be suprised if they can ping for both here? Any ideas?
     
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  9. if you sit above the limit for an hour say, on a highway, is that a single offence?
     
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  10. So if I read Justus right, if you 'confess' to speeding constantly between the first point of detection and the second, only one TIN can be enforced?
    Of course they could challenge your confession but then they'd have to have proof that you weren't speeding at some point??
    Oh I love this one...
     
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    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. My question is why would a cop set up a camera 200 mtrs from a fixed camera ?
     
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Pay the fines, cop the points. Stop speeding on roads if you can't pick cameras. Take it to a track near you.
     
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Standard procedure to have a cop near a camera. You see the camera and relax, then they ping you. Often with trucam or similar (so they don't have to issue a ticket).

    Double jeopardy no longer applies in Qld - they removed that protection after a couple of high profile screw ups by the police meant people walked.
     
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  14. I'm unsure if QLD have managed to pass that bill as yet, but even if they do, you can still only be punished once per offence. Double Jeopardy deals with a person being tried multiple times for the same or similar offence, not punished multiple times.

    If it were as you imply, then every homicide could have an offender found guilty, sentenced, and then tried again so as to increase concurrently any sentence imposed. We could in effect keep putting convicted offenders on trial repeatedly and gaoling them forever.
     
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  15. Compare to Road Transport Act 2013

    s 181 - Double Jeopardy

    (1) A person may be punished only once in relation to the same failure to comply with a particular provision of the road transport legislation, even if the person is liable in more than one capacity.

    (2) Despite subsection (1), a person may be punished for more than one breach of a requirement where the breaches relate to different parts of the same vehicle or combination.


    Apologises guys. Upon reflection and further research to confirm, the previous responses to your posts were not mostly correct, but not entirely, so they were removed the following day to avoid incorrect information being provided and/or accepted by others.

    Justus.
     
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  16. No worries!
     
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  17. Update:

    I've been speaking to tan inspector at the camera office and they say that in cases like mine they usually withdraw the camera offence.

    However, in my case there is no record of the second TIN on their system.

    TO add to the confusion, their records (and the notice I got from sper) show I have paid the traffic camera fine - even though I paid the written fine before I even got the camera one...

    So now, I pretty much can't pay the second fine - the written one is stamped as paid (and there is no record of it on QLD transports system) , and the camera one has actually been paid.

    It would seem that the officer who pulled me over never lodged the fine, or later withdrew it... Waiting for a reply from their office.


    So I guess I'll see what happens.

    Looks like I will only be paying one fine (fingers crossed) - which is awesome because 2 fines = 760 + 10 demerit points ( 4+4 + an extra two for 2 greater than 22kkm/h over offences in a year period)


    (hopefully this makes a bit of sense, it took me a while to figure out myself)
     
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    • Informative Informative x 1
  18. Second notice withdrawn. F*** yeah.
     
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    • Like Like x 1
  19. A good and fair outcome by the sound of it.
     
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  20. So with all the confusion, did u do points?
     
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