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Fatigued cager.

Discussion in 'General Motorcycling Discussion' at netrider.net.au started by mr_messy, Sep 7, 2007.

  1. Another post just reminded me of this.
    On the way home tonight saw this car wobbling left and right in a couple of lanes along Hoodle St. Thought it was a DUI.
    I was staying behind it and at the lights at the corner of Johnson St, my turn of to Yarra bend Rd, I pulled up along side the car.
    The driver was asleep.
    So I beepped her to get her attention and half startled her outta her sleep and I made the sleeping gesture and she nodded. So I signaled for her to pull over. Then she started to nod off again. Started yelling at her through my helmet and pointed at the side of the road. She just looked at me and smiled, maybe thinking I was trying to hit on her.
    The lights went green and she started driving off.

    In this situation what would you have done given the time and opportunity?
    If it was a DUI I think I woulda yelled at them.
    I wanted to get off the bike and talk to her properly or let the cops know.
    It was a white 80's box looking corolla and the lady was maybe in her 50's and smoking too.
  2. Hard one to say but perhaps pull in front of her to prevent her moving? (although she could turn nasty and just run over the bike :shock: ). Then get off the bike and talk to her? That's the reason why the authorities suggest powernaps to prevent these accidents. And if she says she's alrite, perhaps ask her how apologetic will she be to the parents of some kid she could potentially runs over?
  3. wake up guys!

    you open the door and rip the keys out!

    you call the cops!

    you stay the hell away as best you can!

    if you take her to the cops yourself that's called a 'citisans arrest'. tis completely legal to do so.

    cheers :cool:
  4. +1 Stump.

    F*cken oath.

    Shouldve been treated the same as a DUI.

    Drivers actions is identical to one, as is the possible results of
    what could happen.

    Stupid dumbarse 1censored. biatch.
  5. Yes completely legal :shock: :roll:

    Stump think before you type, you shouldn't believe things in movies and take them as gospel :idea:

    I can see where your coing from as you dont want to see some bad shit go down but you cant go grabbing people and taking them to a cop shop legally

    Kidnapping someone or holding them captive for what ever reason isnt ok, vigilantys dont go down to well in australia. In the end you will come up on some serious charges versus Mr/Mrs sleepy driver who at best would get a neg. driving charge :roll:

    Back OT, IMO I think the only safe thing to do is what you did. If you could call the cops and follow them until the cops get there it would be handy (obviously dont go chasing them as a speeding sleeply driver is a disaster waiting to happen).


  6. i didnt mean to load her up in someones car or put her on the back of a bike against her will.

    you take the keys, ask her to go to the side of the road [where she would probably nod off] and CALL the cops. the simplest option is usually the better.

    it's illegal [in NSW] as far as i know, to hold a person against their will, even if they held up a petrol station and you lock the door on them.

    if forget what the word is for it but its the reason why banks and petrol stations dont have double door systems.

    the citisans arrest is completely legal.

  7. Citizens arrest is completely legal, but you must witness them committing an act that is in breach of legislation and have proof. It also works if you have a reasonable belief they are about to commit a crime.

    However, the breach of legislation has to be pretty severe to warrant a citizens arrest. Eg. If I see you speeding by 3kmh, you have breached road safety (or traffic act) legislation, which is punishable by a fine.

    Can you imagine me using force to detain you 'til the cops arrive. I have a feeling I'd be the one in handcuffs.

    What offence would you be arresting this person for? DUI? Careless? Reckless?

    It's the kind of thing that isn't worth you intervening. If you can have a word to her, do it. Otherwise, get the hell out of there.

    Save the citizens arrest for holding an armed robber after they've robbed something (which is perfectly legal, if done properly).


    That's a summary, the legislation will give you a better idea of what you can and can't do. Another spanner in the works is that it varies from state to state. But the basics are the same.
  8. here's how it is,

    if i managed to get her keys and escort her to the side of the road and call the cops, and she tries to


    then i would use force and to hell with what the courts consider to be reasonable. im sure i could drum up a crappy defense (pst! its the crappy ones that work :wink: )

    tis a good thing i took her keys! :LOL:

    [im a smart stump :idea: ]
  9. stump it up!


  10. How could you prove the person was driving dodgy, its ok if they are drunk, but with all the excitment of the cops and everything, the person could look very coherant, you would need witnesses, or you may be charged with assault or even carjacking. Even though you may b on a bike. i think grabbing there keys is not an option, hopefully you have bluetooth connection on the mobile, call cops and follow the car till they get there.
  11. Had a similar occurence on the way home from the Commonwealth games last year. Lady swerving on the road, I pulled up next to her and noticed she was not in full control of the vehicle. I motioned her to pulled over which she did. I then moved off. The next thing I know is I am the lights at Springvale Rd and I hear tearing metal and screeching tyres. The lady had run up along the barrier wall and rolled to a stop around the corner heading left. I parked the bike on the traffic island went to help. Turned out she was diabetic and had not checked her blood levels recently. I stayed with her till the ambo and cops arrived. Took my statement and stuff and was allowed to go on my way. So the lady in the op may have had the same problem. You never know.
    I still would have made her stop
  12. OK, range of opinions here

    Intervention - make lots of noise and direct them to pull over but seriously, don't try to intercept or block. A friend of mine was hit by a driver on heroin and ended up caught on her bumper. The driver didn't stop until after about 50m later when the poor rider managed to reach up and thump on the bonnet of her car. Her (the drivers) story was that she didn't realise that she'd hit anyone. Sad thing is, she probably didn't.

    Don't get too close when approaching a sleeping driver, they may have a violent waking/startled reflex. If you are parked in front of them when their first impulse is to hightail it you could be in for some serious damage.
  13. Can't wait till the next news story of some stupid netrider with charges for falsely imprisoning someone, or robbing their car keys. :roll:

    The best we can do is try to have a talk to them safely. We're neither Judge, Jury nor Executioner. I suggest all the rambos read the afp website a few times.
  14. ummm in neither of those 2 storys did any one use violence to detain the 'ofender' (lay there hands on the 'offender')

    the 1st story sounded like he wasnt going any where fast after he fcuked up doing a burnout, people surrounded his car and gave him the option of running them over (if his car was even in a condition to drive away :? ) or sitting there.

    the 2nd story no one got out and did anything to the DUI driver, they boxed her car in there and waited for police. (that almost sounds like standard sydney driving :LOL: )

    I think when say_what said:
    He was referring to stump, MG etc with there get out grab there keys, roguh them up/use force to hold the offender there mentality. Unless your seeing a shooting, robery etc i dont think using force to hold someone would be tolerated, esspecially for a driving offence.

    My 2 cents

  15. seriously, almost everyone on here is a driver.
    what would get your attention if you were a little too drowsey?
    dont for one second think your better than any other person on the road because you ride, your not. it can happen to anyone. bike or not.
    think about it, how would you like to be treated?
    would you get all defensive if all of a sudden out of the blue (to you) you were screamed at and abused? has it been a long, taxing day?
    look at it from their point of veiw to get a full perspective of what might be happening.
    theres 1000 riders everyday that arent safe and are a hazard on the road, but no one brings that to attention.
  16. twainharti wrote

    MEOW! good one! :LOL:

    menion wrote
    they have fatigue testing nowadays.

    it's very sad that people, adult people, adult diabetic people, don't have the consideration, or maturity to pull over when the moment calls for it. pretty disapointing stuff.

    stump them out! :cool:
  17. From memory, the common law grants every citizen a right to take reasonable steps to prevent the commission of a crime or breach of the peace occurring in his presence.

    Whether, in practice, that would prevent police arresting you or would be a good defence to battery/assault/unlawful detention is another. I wouldn't be game to try it and hope.
  18. pinched from another forum:

  19. I agree I've nodded off in the car and on the bike on occasions. And I've crashed the car once because of fatigue.
    It is easier said than done sometime to make yourself stop.