Mod: This Topic split from https://netrider.net.au/forums/viewtopic.php?t=29744 Sorry it put a damper on your day Tiga. I still thought it was a great ride, and you did a great job leading it. I was just relieved that we didn't have to pick up pieces. I've only been on two rides so far where someone had an off, ( I don't count Roarin' falling off his KTM, as he was just playing around :grin: ) and the other one was on a well organised Ducati Owners Club ride. The guy was hurt, needed an ambulance, and damaged his lovely ST2. Shame. However, I think the guy who came off on the ride you mentioned, and his mate who very nearly did the same thing right in front of me, learned something from the experience. They did slow down, and think about it. Better that they make mistakes with a group of skilled riders who can point out the error of their ways, than on a lone ride at any speed they can reach. Not that I ever want to stand around on the side of the road waiting for an ambulance again, with a guy lying on the side of the road in pain. Nor do I want the hassle of organising a bike pickup, the police reports, or whatever, especially for a stranger. But we know that rider training isn't as good as it should be, and new riders do get a lot of value out of group rides. I get satisfaction out of sheparding those that need it on these rides, and I have provided some direct feedback to those that need it. Mind you, I'm still building up my skills after my break from riding, so I can only do so much. Maybe if the guy on the Gixxer 1000 had done some group rides with Netrider while on his 250 he would have learned something before his stupidity kicked in. Maybe he would have stayed upright on his 250, and would still have been riding it, so he didn't need to buy another bike. Not that I think Netrider owes anything to idiots like this, but maybe we can affect the outcomes, and therefore the public perception of riders. Okay, off the soap box. No criticism intended, quite the opposite. I'm still on track to join you for the Tidal River ride, and I promise to stay on the black top and upright so we can make a great day of it.