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Elec engineering job - what a joke.

Discussion in 'The Pub' at netrider.net.au started by TRA, May 2, 2012.

  1. I did not know I still subscribed to elec engineeriong jobs, but just seen this come through on email.

    http://www.seek.com.au/job/22193339?cid=jobmail

    The position will involve development of new products therefore you must be fully Hardware & Software conversant with USB / RS232 / interfacing / C++/C# programming of 8 & 16 bit PIC microcontroller & posses an understanding of MS Visual Studio.

    Salary:
    $40,000 - $59,999



    I have all those skills, but even at the top salary range of 60k, these folk must be joking. Surely this is a graduate salary these days?

    In the same email, Senior Analyst Programmer jobs are paying $100k+, and the skillset there is less than that of an electronics engineer. Example: http://www.seek.com.au/job/22199012?cid=jobmail and only 3 years experience needed.
     
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  2. just looked at fair work, for an unskilled 20 year old, min wage is about 30k pa. For a 4th year apprentice its about 35k pa.

    why would you spend 4 years at uni to earn less than a tradesman?
     
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  3. Unfortunately that's how it has worked out to be. I went to uni for 3 years and get paid less than a mate who left half way through year 12 and is now an electrician. Granted electricity can be dangerous, but so is working with carcinogenic material...don't know why I even bothered with uni...might go and do an apprenticeship now.
     
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  4. Dont worry, I did a 5 year trade (instrument fitter, aka glorified sparky) after leaving school at 15, then almost completed a degree in elec engineering (4 subjects out!), Now I do neither!

    I looked further into that advert, seem the company in question is an electronics repair firm, so I think they are really just looking for a smart electronics technician.
     
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  5. Why is a 4 year apprenticeship valued less than someone who does 4 years at university with no real world experience?

    There are plenty good trades people who earn 60-70K on a wage, some are even pushing 100K wages, yes wages not salary or contractors.
     
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  6. It is sad that universities are seen as nothing more than vocational schools nowadays.
     
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  7. Ha! - Try becoming a commercial helicopter pilot!
     
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  8. It looks to me like the first job might actually be looking for graduates, in which case maybe the salary isn't as bad as it first seems. 3 years may not sound like much, but it does make quite a difference - it's easy to forget just how much of a greenhorn you were straight out of university. Salaries tend to ramp up pretty quickly over those first few years if you're any good. Also, as an aside I'd be very wary of any place that considers someone with "3 years" experience "Senior"..

    I was going to suggest that maybe the first company might be playing on their reputation (or career progression prospects) too, but I'm no longer convinced that's the case. It may be partly a small company trying the market to see what they can get.

    Although it does seem pretty shitty though that EE's (hard degree, lots of work, deeply technical) would be paid like that after all the work that they put in, if you want an example of another crowd in a similarly bad or worse situation, you should try looking into science jobs.. Unfortunately it's often more viable for some of these highly skilled people to look outside of their chosen field to get work that rewards them appropriately. They don't tell you that at university. :/
     
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  9. Some are pushing a lot more than 100 as well. A couple multiple of it.

    And yes TRA, that is barely 1st year grad wage. Most should be pushing towards 60. Mines start around 80-90 I believe.
     
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  10. You're not wrong. No funding means no job, and if funding is available, it wouldn't be huge either. Science might be good in theory, however in practice, you're out of a job unless you research lands the company a high profit margin. I have 1.5 years left on my contract as a research officer (applied chemist), if no more funding comes through, I'm looking for a new career...which I wouldn't mind actually. I am more mechanically minded than theoretical thinking.
     
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  11. In the short term, sure. Enjoy the same wage as a tradesmen at 25 and 45. I can guarantee you're laughing at tradesmen once you hit your mid-thirties ;p
     
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  12. Or theres work going in my field in darwin, wheatstone and soon abbott point.
    Essentially unskilled (though they would love coastal engineers), just experienced in marine construction and safety... and 350k+expenses a year (im not on that, but am heading there fast!).

    Longlonglong shifts and hours though, and plenty of paperwork and meetings and boredom... cant point at listings, look at the gas and coal projects in those areas and make some calls ;).
     
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  13. A lot of people could put up with a whole lot of boredom for 350k a year. Personally, if leaving the state were an option for me, I'd have tried to join the army again years ago. Sure the pays not that great, but the toys are fun :p
     
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  14. Trade is difficult and being an apprentice you would expect low pay in the first couple of years...................

    Going to Uni is more difficult, you dont get paid, you work 1-3 jobs on the side just to support yourself (I worked on 3 job + full time uni), copious amounts of assisngments and tests, your constantly sleep deprived, be expected to live off a diet of 50c noodles and red bull and if youve earnt enough on your other jobs buy beer....................courses nowdays are expensive expect to owe closer to $80k+ by the time you finish. Some people are down closer to $200k by the time they finish their course, if they finish it............
     
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  15. How you noticed how many managerial and senior jobs there are compared to normal officer type jobs? Its crazy how all these recruiters and companies are trying to make a job look better by slapping on "manager" or "senior" at the end...........

    Im in the science sector myself and the sector is depressing. I feel sorry for ecologists and other environmental workers...........these guys have to fight for their jobs.....against VOLUNTEERS who dont get paid.

    Ive been looking at seek myself and have given up looking at jobs in my own profession..........ive now branched out to BA and PM roles.

    Another pet peeve for me are those "feeler" job ads where theres no actual job, or those jobs that want you to write 350 word response to 12 criterias (council mostly gerrr).

    Science is one of the worst areas to be in, might as well become a teacher. At least its more stable, more holidays, less stress and less work. Ive had mates who did chem eng, bio chem, geo swap to teaching.

    1.5 year contract would be a godsend for me.........im usually on a 3 months contract with no extension. I just go in set up their templates and go out again.......no fricken stability.

    Do they need any enviro eng/town planner/enviro consultant? Heck id work cleaning up their toilets for that amount heheheh :).
     
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  16. So you're saying, you should be higher valued in the community because you went down the route of education and you've devalued a person who gets their hand dirty?

    I really struggle with concepts like yours, yes, first and foremost I am a tradesman. I started working and took home about $145 a week and worked 40+ hours, now that was close to 20 years ago. Fast forward that up to 18 months ago, and now I employ up to 10 staff in my own business.
    To be honest, if two people walked through my door for the same position I'd more than likely pick the one with street smarts over the one who learnt out of a book and a lecturers beliefs.

    The education system is not about giving you the education you need, it's all about money and lots of it. I bet most tradies will screw people like you to the wall when they get a call out, it's just a bit of vengeance.

    By the way, I have been selected to be on a board to advise on changes required in a certain field of trade. It's voluntary and I'm pretty passionate about it as industry training needs a massive shake up!
     
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  17. Things have certainly turned on their heads haven't they? Our company employs several techies to maintain and service our (very) complex imported products. We know that some of our competitors send similar equipment to Thailand for service because the wages are 15% of what they are here. Worth it, even if it adds a week to the turnaround.
    Your competing in a world market now. A third world market.
     
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  18. My University of Canberra Professor in Economics Dr Phil Lewis (Phil Lewis is Professor of Economics and Director of the Centre for Labour Market Research (CLMR) at the University of Canberra. Phil is among the best-known economists in the area of the economics of employment, education and training in Australia and is the author of over 100 publications) did a study/report on trade v degree (probably because of the 30 odd guys in High Viz flouro sitting together in his lectures complaining how we were conscripted into the class - in the long run degree wins hands down in respect to financial reward.

    If I could find it I would link to it for you.

    When things go to crap in Australia a degree will open a door for you to opportunities in other countries should you choose to look elsewhere beyond our borders - a trade certificate/licence will not.
     
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  19. #19 Ljiljan, May 3, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2015
    Friend of mine on a mine in qld. 6 months out of uni was managing his unit.

    2
     
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  20. Nah not devalue. I think if your good at your field then you should be rewarded for it..........but seriosuly dude when your paying for a course that would cost you at least $80k to $200k upwards in debt then you would think that there was some form of reward at the end of the tunnel.........

    See, theres a place for people with street smarts and theres a place for others who learn theories............theres currently a brain drain in Australia where the best and brightest have gone off to other countries or left their profession because of lack of opportunities. This would result in Australia becoming less competitive and less innovative.
     
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