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Ducati Vs Jap

Discussion in 'General Motorcycling Discussion' at netrider.net.au started by da_matrix, Jul 13, 2007.

  1. So.. comparing the 1000s are ducati's really the "best" not considering their price tag. It seems to me the jap bikes produce more or less the same Hp and weight considerably lighter than the ducati.

    Can anyone explain to be why and finally if they are simply over priced

    And why do i want one :LOL: ?

    Is it because its red and exclusive and red
    and red :p


     
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  2. v-twins have a character that "jap inline-4"'s don't have. Same goes for triples, they have something that inline-4's lack.

    Waits for fights ;)

    And yeah, ducati's are overpriced :D
     
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  3. They make "jap v-2's" as well you know!
     
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  4. Oh, so that's what my VTR250 was :wink: :LOL: As stated, I mentioned Jap inline 4's as that's the most "usual" comparison for "jap" vs "other" :)
     
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  5. Ride them and then come and tell us what you think :cool:
     
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  6. Hahaha love to, but im a P plater :LOL:

    And im not sure if i can afford it if i take the $50000+ 999r around the block, imagine how much it would cost if i broke a peg :eek:
     
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  7. A bike is worth what someone will pay.

    Some think the Ducs are overpriced, chances are they haven't ridden one.

    I took a Sport 1000 for a ride and don't think it could be my only bike, but I'd love it to be my second as nothing comes close from any other manufacturer.
     
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  8. What is best is what is best for you, and that's different for everyone.

    I have never aspired to own a Duc or even been interested in them, but after seeing a 1098 in the flesh and reading the rave reviews in AMCN-Masterbike a few weeks back there is a little part of me that would love one. I don't know what others think, but to me the 1098 is one of the most beautiful sportsbikes I have ever seen. And the sound of that twin, wow!! :twisted:
     
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  9. I've heard it said that when someone buys a Duke, the heart, not the head, is the one that makes the decision. I guess at that point, the cost is almost irrelevant :p

    Having ridden a 916, RSV Mille and various Japanese I4s, I always thought the Italian brands felt a lot more "planted" in the corners and were easier to ride quick. Personally I think the Italian bikes have more class and timeless beauty compared to the Japanese bikes and although they don't have the highest BHP numbers, they generally lap quicker than the equivalent I4.

    But, are they worth the extra money?? I suppose only your heart and soul can answer that :p :p :p

    btw, mine say YES!!
     
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  10. Is that why the superbike class called 750cc fours equivalent to 1000cc twins?

    and why they are now looking at 1200cc twins?

    Not really match racing is it! You either have the same vehicle rules and it comes down to the rider, or you cut down the tall poppies and say it is down to the bike!
     
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  11. I could be wrong, but didn't they restrict CCs to 750 for fours and 1000 for twins in the superbike class due to power to weight ratios?
     
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  12. First question: which 1000 Ducati, the only 1000 Ducati make is a two valve aircooled motor which goes into the sport classic range and the S2R Monster. This is a wonderful motor but does not have much hp (around92)
    Next. The japanese tend to quote weight figures on a completely dry bike, ie one that does not have fuel, oil, coolant, air in the tyres or battery. That could explain the weight differences.
    Next. define overpriced. Have u actually had a close look at the new 1098 or any of the range. Do yourself a favour, wander into a dealership and have a good look at the overpriced exotica and then make another statement
    I have had my Duke now for almost 6 years and over 100 000 km. I still get a thrill every time it fires up. The japanese bike I had before it did not stir my loins the same way. So for me it is very simple. The Ducati is worth every last cent.
    Scumbag out
     
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  13. precisely - so how does it make sense to cut the legs off the better tool and then say that the other one is better? The original comment was about track times after all.
     
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  14. That's a big generalisation right there. At master bike the times for the twins and I4's (750-1000cc) where all within a bees you know what. With the 750 actually having a faster time than a twin. But mostly the times where spread all over the place.

    Masterbike best average lap times-
    R1 - 1:53:675
    MV R312 - 1:53:767
    ZX10 - 1:53:983
    CBR1000 - 1:53:983
    GSXR1000 - 1:54:240
    1098S - 1:54:250
    GSXR750 - 1:54:406
    RSV1000 - 1:54:698
     
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  15. the reason I mentioned that is that the OP opinion of the twins and fours producing "more or less the same power" is not correct. The ready to roll weight for the two is probably fairly similar, however the four cylinder models produce higher peak power, and also produce the same power for longer when compared to the twins (ie higher rpm ceilings). This is the reason that high revving engines always beat low revving engines of the same power - you can hold a gear longer - this gives rise to special racing categories for the crowd who can't stand using the wrong technology for the job and therefore take their bat and ball elsewhere.

    As ducati found with superbike and motogp, you just can't compete with a twin given the same criteria as an open field.

    - Buying a duke from the spec sheet is therefore silly given the racetrack results
    - looking at a mixed racing class and saying A is better than B is unrealistic as a means of choosing a personal road bike
    - people who buy bikes based on the percieved impression by others are loony.

    Pick what you like riding the most and you will get the most enjoyment from it. This is not necessarily the flashiest or the bike you dreamed about as a kid (or even as an adult).
     
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  16. I can't speak for Ducati, but having seen how Scumbag punts his 85hp, 220kg ST2 around, power ain't the be all and end all.

    I was disdainful of Italian V-Twins until Scummy rode a Tuono to Friday night coffee. At that moment I knew I needed one. When my financial situation took a change last year I got one. Since then I've been in love with an inanimate objcect :) It's the only bike that I've ever owned that actually makes me 'feel' something and it certainly attracts attention. Is it worth the $22k based on materials alone? Who knows, but for me, it was worth every single cent.

    As mentioned in another thread, bikes are more than just transport (for a lot of people anyway). If your chosen steed doesn't move you, then there will be another one that will. They are therefore worth whatever you want to pay for them.
     
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  17. *nods head* Most likely the reason why people buy $40K harley/cruisers etc that sport bike riders couldn't comprehend and think it's such a rip off price. A bike is worth every cent you paid I think would be a common thought in my view. The grin factor when riding is priceless.....
     
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  18. I was going to sugggest that the Japanese are simply more efficient at building bikes, with economies of scale making them cheaper.
    But then I remembered that in Europe, that's not necessarily the case. Jap bikes (at least the top end race replicas and bling machines) are often at the top end of the non-exotic (ie. large production run) sector in terms of price.
    That's not down to transport costs either - it's only slightly more expensive to ship to UK from Japan that to Australia.
    What it actually comes down to is how much a buyer is prepared to pay. In Europe, buyers are willing to pay more for high performance Japanese sportsbikes than Australians are. Conversely, Aprilias, KTMs and Gguzzis are much cheaper over there. Curiously, Triumphs are cheaper in Australia than their home country.
    Ducati has traditionally supported it's sales with three selling points: drop-dead gorgeous styling; exemplary handling; and desmodromic valve actuation.
    The latter is something that almost no-one else in the bike world will touch. It's more expensive to manufacture and maintain, but it offers some engineering advantages. Enough to justify the price? You decide.
    It's worth remembering that some Ducati models are no more expensive than their Japanese competitors.
    In the end, it's the buyer who determines how much the manufacturer can sell his product for.
     
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  19. Ducatis turn heads. Girls love em, Guys go gaga over them. The sound is one of the best sounds in the world. So when you ride them you cannot but feel special and passionate about your mount. You are Ducatisti!

    They are literally the ferraris of the bike world. I say literally cause my 748SP cost a bomb to maintain and never ran when i wanted it to. My side stand just decided to fall off one day. My whole left hand fairing decided to part from the bike on another. Mine always had something niggly and annoying wrong with it. But you get that from hand built bikes. Its all part of the Ducati Experience.

    Would i do it again? In my experience probably not. Was it worth it - yes!
     
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  20. :eek: . . . scumbag !!!
    shame on you on your Ducati knowledge !!

    What about the S4R Teststretta . . . . . desmoquattro (4valve) watercooled 1000cc.

    that is so true !
    . . . and you end up buying the shirts, jackets, mugs, keyrings, diecast models and personalised numberplates ! :p
     
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