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Draggin Jeans vs Hornee Jeans...My outcome!

Discussion in 'Riding Gear and Bike Accessories/Parts' started by Removed_User4, Jan 15, 2007.

  1. Based upon my post headed Draggin vs. Hornee in the link below.

    Please read the link first as this is where the journey begins.

    As there didn’t seem to have any independent results of motorcycle jeans anywhere I thought I would share my outcome of research to people whom want to purchase a protective casual pants to minimize there work in decision making. These are my opinions only, for what ever my opinion is worth to you. Now I’m quite pedantic when buying stuff, I believe in research to buy once properly the first time and I believe sliding down the road at speed from a motorcycle fall is a terrible vision. So I wanted to find the truth about the two most popular named motorcycle jeans available on the market at the moment in Australia. My attitude towards purchasing this type of pants is for purely protection from abrasion injury and convenience to wear than just the esthetics which is further down the track in my mind. Before buying any motorcycle protective gear I think everyone should look at this link below. It’s very informative;


    In the last couple of weeks I went shopping particularly for Hornee Jeans but also asking shop assistants for their opinions of the two. I tried many of the Hornee Jeans on, purchased a pair of light blue denims, tried them, felt them, rode in them and really gave them a good inspection. (I wasn’t dedicated enough to go for a slide down the road for protection results.) My opinion on the Hornee's are they are to low cut around the hip bones (on me) exposing them to the road in case of a fall, the material/denim even brand new is soft not feeling durable, and the denim and the kevlar are definitely not as thick or knitted as well as Draggin's. Both the Hornee and Draggin Jeans in the normal length pants have the Kevlar to high in the leg for me, when I’m on the bike the bottom of the Kevlar sits only to the bottom of my knee cap. I’m 178 cm tall which is average height so it’s not an issue of me being tall that this occurs. But from years previously of weight training I probably have a thicker leg for most people my height. This may be of reason why this occurs.

    I tried to contact the Hornee manufacturer in NSW and got an answering machine which I left a message and tried to call a few times over a period of a couple of days and constantly got the answering machine. Apparently this is what normally occurs where as a person was always there to answer Draggin’s phone. After 3 days from the message I left at Hornee, I received a call in-which the male caller whom had the same voice on the answering greeting was courteous. I asked if Hornee make a jean/pants which has a longer leg for taller riders which the reply was they don’t, (and if like Draggin) would they install an extra/longer piece of Kevlar, which they won’t. I was offered a second pair for free from another a range of theirs which was fair compensation. This was before they knew of an article was being composed. Hornee will attend to the length concern of the Kevlar being short in future batches I was told. They also are bringing out a camouflage version shortly.

    I think the benefits of the Hornee jeans over the Draggins are;

    At the moment you get a full length pocket of Kevlar lined pants with Hornee even though the Kevlar is a bit too short in the leg though (about the same length of Kevlar as Draggins in the leg) compared to partial inserts in the Draggins. I think a full length Kevlar pocket is important as you never know how you will fall. It would be quite easy to lose grip around a corner then regain grip making the bike kick and kicking you off. This could kick you on top of the bike or washing the bike on top of you as you or the bike goes down, grazing the front or back of your legs over a jagged section on the bike which may have broken or (there’s plenty of bush on the side of Australian roads) if you slide into bushes that break from impact minimizing sharp sections abrasing thighs. There’s numerous things that could scrape on your thighs. Travelling on an unfamiliar road at night once, distracted by a cloud of bugs I ran through now glued to my visor and entertained by the fraction of the sound barrier my speedo was reading, I would have ran into heavily thick bushes entering a corner way to fast if I didn’t make the corner. If I went through them, these bushes would have bent or broke grazing me at the speed I was travelling. Luckily I made the corner and didn’t experience a mishap. Walter carrying me bent over on his son's borrowed bike to hospital was the last thing I wanted. They don’t make leather pants with just partial sections of leather so I don’t know why the current Draggins are.

    The Hornee perhaps looks and fits TRENDIER than the Draggin. A matter of opinion though.

    Hornee should give adequate bottom, thigh, hip and knee abrasion protection at a typical legal Australian speed limited fall though at higher end on legal speed limited falls heat blistering from road friction and/or friction from the skin rubbing inside the pants may be experienced. Recommended for people who will stick to the speed limit.

    Well during the last week I visited Draggin Jeans in South Melbourne. They were very helpful and I spent a good hour and a bit trying on several pants asking different staff lots of questions discussing what I want to do on motor bikes and what I expect in safety jeans probably frustrating the begeesus out of them, but I got to the truth.

    Now the Draggin’s again for me had the Kevlar to low not covering enough knee or any upper shin. But they will add an extra section in that section if you require it. They also make a standard longer jean version for taller people whom they don’t have a large stock of compared to their normal length jeans but it’s for the same price. The kevlar covered well for me in the longer pants though with the denim leg now to long for me. A matter for me to hem them up. Draggin Jeans felt superior in durability in both the denim and Kevlar. The Kevlar feeling more confident in a mishap. The staff at Draggin showed me independent testing reports on different jeans on the market including their own and the opposition's Hornee, Draggins passed a good 4 fold over Hornee and the others in this test. This test carried out by the Australian Wool & Textile Authority they explained goes something like this. The counts of revolutions of an abrasive wheel which rotates in a very small surface till the kevlar has been worn through. Draggin’s results were 900 revolutions compared to Hornee’s 200 revolutions. The test speaks for itself in which I think one can feel in the product itself the difference in the sturdiness from each manufacturer’s material. Draggin also are near the completion of a new prototype pants nick-named the CE pants. This is fully Kevlar lined through-out from the top of the waist to the very bottom of the leg.

    I think the benefits of the Draggin Jeans over the Hornee are;

    The material and kevlar are sturdier than Hornee

    The construction and stitching is superior to Hornee (This is very important with all motorcycle apparel) minimizing bursting on impact. Though neither claim to never had seems burst on impact.

    Higher in the waist covering hip bones more.

    Ability to attach knee pads inside.

    Better customer service and willing to adjust/add Kevlar if needed. Though Hornee offered me an additional pants for free for my inconvenience from a new camouflage range they are releasing in March. This was offered well before this article was known to them and before I began to write it.

    Make a longer leg pants for taller people which a shorter person can still use if needing lower sitting knee sectioned Kevlar as long as one is prepared to hem them.

    At the moment have more of a range of styles than Hornee

    Will shortly have pants which are fully Kevlar lined through-out from the top of waist to bottom of the leg.

    As jeans are loose around the knee and their current knee impact protector attaches to the inside of the pants, I'd like to see a larger wider knee pad fitted to give a broader knee impact coverage in case the knee of the pants slightly twisted around just to give adequate knee impact protection coverage in a fall.

    My opinion is if your going to have a typical slide down the road at speeds up to 140 kmh the draggins are the better casual pants to wear. They would provide better abrasion protection at a higher speed slide than Hornee providing your only ever contact on the ground in the pants were the bottom and/or knee. I think the kevlar in the hip and side of leg area is way to narrow but still provides abrasion protection. They have been tested from zero to 185kmh to zero again with no break through of the kevlar. But like anything, skin blistering from friction of road occurs and/or friction from the skin rubbing inside the pants may be experienced during falls. Once Draggin have a full Kevlar lined pants on the market with a larger knee impact pad they will be the best pants on the market other than racing leather bottoms or at least until another product comes out.

    This maybe sooner than people think look at this link cb250goespop provided in another topic which I found;


    But I think from my research carried out shark and/or stingray leather is the ultimate way to go read esp 2nd paragraph; http://www.elasmo-research.org/education/white_shark/scales.htm

    And the first paragraph of this; http://www.exoticleather.biz/shark_leather.htm


    17/1/2007 Ive spoken to Hornee again today. They inform me they have other products such as jackets and kevlarlined leathers which have not yet been released to the public but may soon. They may also forward tests of their own product which maybe included here or respond here to the article themselves.
  2. Fantastic write up Smarteee :grin:

    An excellent and well researched comparison which will save a lot of time for anyone looking to purchase some Kevlar pants.

    Well done :wink:
  3. draggins make chinos too.

    acceptible for work. good kevlar coverage (comes to mid shin on me (6") when riding)

    after time the black fades. they cost $20? more than the other styles.
  4. Recent (two weeks ago) testing on my Draggins indicate that my only injury was a kevlar burn about the size of a 20c piece on my left knee. (If I had been wearing my nomal lycra stuff under them at that time, there would have been no skin damage at all). There is slight tearing on the outside material, which will be easy to fix.

    Yes the black does fade, but what jean of any sort doesn't?
  5. Hey Smartee
    Exellent Research
    thanks for takeing the time to do it

    Exellent i have been waiting on these to be made

    is there any time frame that you/they know
    when these will be available ?
  6. Thanks for the great writeup.

    I just bought a second pair of Draggins, the black cargo pants. They feel much lighter and more comfortable than the traffic jeans.
  7. +1 on the writeup!

    I've had a pair of Draggin cargo's for the past 2 years and they're still going strong.

    My only problem with them is that they were a fraction too long in the leg for me, and I was too lazy to get them taken up. So my heel's frayed the bottom of the pants legs at the back, and they've started to rip vertically. My bad, nothing to do with the quality of the pants.

    Haven't road tested them, but they're very comfortable.

    My next riding pants, however, will probably be a set of the RJays or DriRider textile pants with zip-out liners and both knee and hip armour. They're waterproof, and should be good in all weather. And I think their protection level would be a bit greater than the Draggins.
  8. They can make them for you now but the turn around time is 4 weeks and will cost you extra. This extra price I will find out on Tuesday.
  9. +1 for the write up!!!! been trying on a couple myeself... havent purchased any yet though... but your research helps heaps...thanks again mate :beer:
  10. thanks for the write up.. i ended up with black draggin cargos for $150
  11. I cannot believe that a company would lower themselves to such a level where they felt the need to suggest to the OP that legal action may be available to them as an option for the OP's comments.

    If Hornee Jeans needs to behave in such a fashion then it only goes to prove their quality of leadership/direction/product.

    If every company on this planet behaved in such a manner then there would not be one single solitary review site on the internet.

    Seriously, take the comments as opinions, buy some concrete & reo and build yourself a bridge.

    What is the world coming to when companies such as this need to blow up their chests, beat them like a classic rockape and suggest the possibility of legal action willy nilly.

    The OP has every right as a consumer to voice their OWN opinion on a product that they paid for.

    Despite the fact that the OP panicked and requested removal of this post, this post will remain on these forums for the motorcycling public to peruse and form their own opinion on each product that is reviewed.
  12. You are of course jesting about the legal action?

    I thought the writeup was excellent and all the comments were incredibly balanced. Even when a negative comment was made, it was immediately offset with a reason why that may be. There was enough in both writeups for people to make their own mind up and buy either of the two brands.

    Indeed, what has it come to?
  13. :shock: :eek:

    Wow that says a lot for their company, doesn't it?
  14. If they had any smarts about themselves they would address their issues instead of trying to silence their critics.
  15. Nope going by the convo last night at coffee the company in question, where not being very friendly at all towards the OP
  16. Guess which brand I will never be buying or considering. They are really so stupid with their actions, this post is great for people looking at the pro's & con's, now they have an added option of understanding the people behind Hornee.

    I guess the hornee bastard won't be up for long :p :LOL:

    Guess this ad is so true now. They are award winning.

    Hornees just won the how to loose customers award. :eek:

    I feel this thread deserves to be a sticky...all done :grin:
  17. Great write up smartee.

    I do have one question though.
    By damage, does this mean a clear hole and if so what size? Also, is this damage to the denim or kevlar?

    I would also like to add as my personal oppinion that to come off doing 140 in any denim casual motorcycle jeans suggests the rider may have been inapropriately dressed. I would be wearing something far more substantial when riding hard at those speeds. Kevlar jeans I only wear on the fwy cause the chances of falling in a straight line are far less. :)

    Final comment is that I love my hornee jeans. They're comfortable, hard wearing and look great. However threatening members of this forum with legal action for making valid factual comments (as is their right as a consumer) has likely cost hornee any future business from myself. I do hope the management at hornee put their heads out of their arses and offer Smartee some appology.
  18. Hang on everyone.

    I must clarify whats been passed around. Hornee never directed legal action in the manner as some of you have been suggesting on your post's. I interpreted their comments as constituting a subtle threat in terms of legal action from what their initial reaction during their first phone conversation re my topic. There was definitely no serious threat of that in the manner as some of you have been suggesting on your post's. The guys at Hornee discussed a certain concern within the article and I thinks its fair to give Hornee an opportunity to resolve a couple of issues they raised with me.

    However yourselves interpret my article, I used Hornee and Draggin as the topic solely because they both are the top selling motorbike jeans on the market at this stage in Australia and I know that people would like to hear peoples opinions. Irrespective of my article, I'm not telling people what to buy and I believe that Hornee Jeans are better than some other jeans that are on the market at the moment.

    Having developed products myself, I know that new products can take time to improve/perfect which is a learning curve for everyone whom enters a market place. So give the guys at Hornee a chance.
  19. Dood, even the most subtle of hints at legal action for you voicing your opinion is enough to warrant a stand-offish approach to the company.

    If they have issues, then deal with then with your R&D dept. All this legal shmegal crap annoys me.

    This isn't the playground, this is grown up stuff.....apparantly ;)

    I was thinking of a second pair of Jeans to take to Tassie.
    Might check out the Shift Jeans ;)
  20. i think ill stick with my personal experiences with both companies as imho smarteeee regularly misrepresents his interactions with people.