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Does time spent riding inherently translate into experience?

Discussion in 'General Motorcycling Discussion' started by modern_ninja, Mar 15, 2011.

  1. Yes. Time on a bike disqualifies some. Learners/Newer riders should stay quiet.

  2. No. Time on a bike doesn't disqualify some. It just needs to be right.

  1. Couple of times i've had people ask, "what makes you think you can give advice?"

    So I'd like to gauge NR's opinion on this.

    Does time spend riding inherently relate to experience?

    Is there some time limit at which people are able to give advice if they wish?

    Can a Learner/Newer Rider give advice if it is right? (if they are dumb and get everything wrong, then they should keep their mouth shut)

    Does the rider have to be awesomely fast to be able to give advice?

    Does the size of ones bike directly affect how much people should listen?

    The reason I ask is, I don't like giving advice on things I haven't yet become really competent at. I believe i'm competent at city riding and commutting and roadcraft in traffic. I believe I could give some good ideas that might actually help people.

    Should newer riders that are competent at certain skills be passing on some of their views to other riders? Or should they stay quiet?
  2. Hehehe, thanks smee. I take that as a good sign.

    Way i see it, there are some newer riders out there with some great skills (not neccesarily getting a knee down) that could help plenty of other riders. There are also some older riders that shouldn't teach their kids how to ride a bicycle because they have some horrendous ideas about riding.

  3. wow 10 mins and not a bite
  4. Some one that has done a lot of miles on a bike in all conditions, Can usually give good advice,

    Long time riders have learnt to do things automatically,

    new riders are still learning just to stay upright, It all takes time and a lot of miles under your bum,

    New riders can divulge their riding experiences to other new riders, It helps new riders to understand what they are doing, Right or wrong, Its all a learning curve,
  5. Doesn't matter who you are or how you think. It's how you're perceived.

    Go up to the Kew Boulevard and have a chat with a few of the guys there. They "THINK" they know it all, and they willfully give you the "BEST" advice and what they think is the right way.

    This will certainly be a great thread, just gonna sit back and watch.
  6. depends on if you are a good learner; some people know it all, no matter what they are doing, and never learn, either from instruction or from experience
  7. As a general trend, I would think more experienced riders know more about it, but one should remember that just because John Doe has done something for twenty years, doesn't mean that he does it right, or that his opinions on many aspects are correct, or the only correct answer.

    From my early days on bikes, especially when I was a new road rider, I remember getting (often un-asked for) advice from older and more experienced people (riders, ex-riders, and a never wassas) that was sometimes right and sometimes shockingly wrong.

    The examples that spring first to mind have to do with braking, ("That's a front brake, son. You don't touch that, or you'll crash.") and stability and wobbles / tank-slappers.

    The advice they handed out on less critical things like suitable clothing, and what worked for winter clothing and such, was also often wrong.

    Some aspects of riding don't change, but some do, and old blokes often want to tell you stuff that was relevant and correct and vital when they were riding their BSA Bantam in 1951, but the equipment and tech and circumstances have changed drastically, and much of what they learned is just irrelevant today.

    Remember - those who can - do. Those who can't - teach.
  8. 1.Old habits are hard to get rid of. Even bad ones.
    2. I have worked for three riding schools in my time. And had to teach three different ways. Did not matter what I thought or how I thought. It was to be done their way, by their manual. So who even with experience is ultimately right ???? In a way it is a good thing. I have learn a lot. A lot more as an instructor than I ever did as a rider. If that makes any sense.
    3. It's the internet. Once you start on censorship, where does it end and once again who is to say.
    4. Usually the consensus is pretty right.
  9. Experience is experience, and there's always value in sharing it - whether or not the lesson is readily apparent or not.

    We can learn from people's mistakes just as much (if not more) than we can from their correct handling of a situation.

    As for specific advice on technique, it should be approached with the same hefty grain of salt you'd apply to anyone's advice - I've heard extremely experienced (and talented) people give terrible advice to beginners (who simply don't have the skill to implement that advice safely).
  10. Sage words Grumplier.

    On a different tack:

    There are some who have been "riding" for decades and could not drive a greasy stick up a cats arse, and there are relatively new riders who have natural ability; having said that, the ability to impart knowledge or a technique is a different set of skills.

    If you think you have a good idea or just want to help and you feel like imparting something, do it.... There is no law against free speach Bud!
  11. I'm a sailing instructor and though a different skill the same principles apply in my opinion considering what I've seen before. I got my instructors at 15. I saw people more than twice my age who had sailed for more than my lifetime but couldn't actually sail.

    There are some people out there naturally gifted at things and pick things up. There are people out there who do things for eons and never pick it up. It's an individual thing really, and not everyone is suited to teaching either!

    Though this is just from what I've read and know (very little lol) about bikes so far I gather is reasonably similar-ish lol
  12. KC said it best. When advice is consistent with bike technology then it's worth listening to.
  13. Amen to that.

    Teaching stuff is actually a very good way to learn more yourself. Note that many instructor pilots are only two or three steps up the ladder from the people they're teaching. When I was studying computing, I learned a lot from trying to coach and help other students.

    And I've learned a few things about riding - and teaching - from trying to help other riders.

    Here's an idea - I had a girlfriend (I was quite young) and a big bike. She could ride a pushbike, sort of, and wanted to learn to ride a motorbike. ... riiiight ... So I took her out onto a mostly straight country road, and put her in front. I had her crouch down and let me use the pegs and foot controls, and got moving, up to top, then gave her the bars and pegs, and started out with my hands over the top of hers. We went round a few bends, moved the bike this way and that a bit, then I shifted my grip to her wrists, then her elbows, and finally just let her ride the thing. Within a half hour, she could ride a motorbike. Not very well, or with any great skill, but she understood the basics - including counter-steering. That was the first thing she asked about when we stopped. It was a very successful technique - and I've never seen it used anywhere.
  14. Time spent riding is like going through life.

    The older/more experience you get, the more you realise that you don't know, and the more you realise that what works for you is different for someone else, and so just tend to shut up about it.

    If someone watches you ride and asks you for advice, directly and personally, on something they've specifically seen you do and take an interest in, then yeah, that seems to be about the only time I tend to give advice nowadays unless it's really basic stuff.

    Yeah, I've opened up my mouth heaps in the past. I was certainly guilty of that if anyone still wants to point the finger. Now, unless someone is giving blatantly wrong and/or dangerous advice, my attitude is simply to let it go. Until I've seen how someone actually rides, and until they've seen how I actually ride, and we've all reached an understanding where we're all coming from, the giving advice on an internet forum is little more than the blind leading the blind.
  15. Shallow words. Dare you say to that to all the ex-world champion racers who run sports riding schools.

    Would you say that to Rossi if he opened up a rider training school after he retired?
  16. Depends on the manner of his exit from the sport. It was a joke, and I didn't make it up. My mother is - was - a teacher, and it's a gag she often drops. It seems to be particularly true of ex dancers, figure skaters, divers... stage actors of the Shakespearian type...

    Randy Mamola and King Kenny are both a bit older than me, and very definitely, both are still capable of riding at very close to grand prix race pace even now. Kenny can even still punt the TZ 750 dirt tracker at race pace, and that's a jaw-dropping thing to watch. They might struggle to last full race distance but. And they wouldn't bounce as good.

    Wayne Rainey could probably teach you a thing or two ...
  17. What an absolute load of bullshit.

    The best people are the ones who can teach since they CAN DO.
    Not everyone ho can do can teach.
    It takes talent to do both and impart that knowledge.
    Seriously the ignorant and the stupid are the ones who believe that shit quoted.
  18. Exactly, and he can't ride, so by definition, he can't and he teaches.
    So, were you out to prove or disprove your point? Seems like you did the latter, so why quote it if it's garbage?
  19. :rolleyes: :inquisition:
    It's a very old joke. Sorry you didn't recognise it as such. Maybe I know too many teachers ...

    "It's like a finger pointing to heaven. [slap] Don't look at the finger! You're missing all that heavenly beauty."