Welcome to Netrider ... Connecting Riders!

Interested in talking motorbikes with a terrific community of riders?
Signup (it's quick and free) to join the discussions and access the full suite of tools and information that Netrider has to offer.

does jesus believe you?

Discussion in 'The Pub' at netrider.net.au started by flexorcist, Oct 9, 2007.

  1. I was going to put this in PL&G because specifically relating to me it's to get my licence back, however it relates to anything really, so i put it in here.

    in australia, generally speaking, the church and state are seperate. in order to get a licence back, (or answer any question in court), you are forced (from the experience of 2 mates of mine), to swear on the bible. i'm not religious, (i'm not an athiest either), but i really have a strong opinion against religion in general.

    if i was a different religion, say muslim, could i request a koran, if i was jewish, request the first amendment?

    why will i be forced to put a hand on something i think is lies to tell the truth?

    your thoughts...

  2. I don't know your answer, but I really like your question. :)
  3. You either do it their way or give the magistrate a blowie. Your choice mate.
  4. If you are a follower of Islam you can swear on a Quran.

    I also thought you didn't have to swear on any book if you didn't want to???
  5. there is some capacity whereby you can swear by the crown. i dont remeber the details exactly, but i do remember at my enlistment ceromony where i sweared on the bible (since im catholic) a couple of other blokes who were not religious swore by the crown.
    swore by as in taking an oath to serve you country etc etc, i believe a similar procedure would ensue in the courts as you are taking an oath when giving evidence.
  6. flex i was thinking about this today!!!

    you make a great point!!!!

    i decided in my thoughts that if a family member had past, you could swear in their name.

    but then, people will always cross their fingers :LOL:
  7. Going Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back to 78 when I joined the NAVY, we had to swear on the bible to obey queen / country etc etc . Not being the religious type [ even back then :p ] I didn't want to hold the thing, let alone swear on it........ low and behold the officer doing the oath whispered in my ear to open the book up but keep it to myself and the guys nearest me.

    It was a bloody oxford dictionary with a false cover :LOL: :LOL:

    We where told later that they could never find enough bibles for the big intakes so had some ' backups' on hand from earlier times :rofl:

    But I was still honor bound to the oath in my heart regardless.
    To me its the words not what you swear on.
  8. i agree. but i have my reasons for not wanting to touch a bible. i might just ask for an affirmation.

    it's just that one friend got told he had no choice, the other had his hand forcibly placed on the bible.
  9. Stigger has answered the question in spades.

    :LOL: at Bob... I swear on the holy dictionary, that i'll never cheat at scrabble... :LOL:

    An oath is a sacred thing, a bond with your self. Bible or not.
  10. I prefer to take the "f*cken oath." I place my hand firmly on the rump of the lass I'm f*cken and swear me head off.

  11. It burns, it burns!

    Good topic, glad others have pondered this situation too.

    Regards, Andrew.
  12. i'm relieved tbh. i was waiting for the "dude, not here" messages. :)
  13. Most people ask for divine intervention when they lose their license, mightn't they also involve God when they're getting it back?
  14. if devine is a chinese kid in a supra, then my bike and i had divine intervention from each other, and i'm more likely to go "oh get f*d" rather than "oh my god", same as FFS, thank f*....

    basically f* can replace so many words...

    jebus, sex, the list doesn't end
  15. in the courts, you are not required to swear on the bible.
    you are required to swear, and take an oath, but "on the bible" is only an option. it is always the first thing they offer, but it is not the limit of your options.

    appearances - 4
    bible oaths - 0
    favourable decisions - 3
  16. Hey Flex..

    You back on the road again or what?

    I remember ages ago you had an accident &/or trouble with
    the Police.
  17. hopefully 24th Oct.
    they told me suspended but they cancelled it. i have a lot of arguments but was advised if i was going to argue i should have done it ages ago. when i thought it was suspended it didn't fuss me too much, figuring i wait, go to vicroads, get my licence. unfortunately it was cancelled and seeing i was refused a blood test when i had a broken jaw, (prescription mouthwash containing 11.6% ethanol taken undiluted 4 times a day, when recommended is 3 times diluted), i'm not happy about being the .02 that means i get a mandatory interlock. my bike also got written off and i've sold my cars. unfortunately due to other summary offences i'm automatically disqualified for a loan, so being back on the road won't mean actually being back on the road.

    i'll put the interlock on my gf's car, but i'm not happy about having my 2 children in the back of the car, and having to pull over and blow into a f'n thing. i don't think it's in the best interest of my children to have yet another distraction put on anyone driving them about. unfortunately it's mandatory so it's another thing i'm gonna have to cop sweet.

    so, for everyone else.... i know a fair few of you think don't drink ever and ride, but don't ever move your bike 300m down the road so it's not out the front of a pub vulnerable to drunks, because you will regret it.
  18. SHIT.. I didnt know it was THAT bad. Daaam :oops:

    With the cancelled license, does that mean you have to do Learners
    etc again??

    or is it that you have to apply to the Courts to get ya full license back

    With the interlocking device, how long does it have to be fitted for?

    & lastly, how does offences stop you from getting a loan? I've got a
    decent rap sheet but it dosent stop me getting any loans. They dont
    even ask if you've had convictions anyways.. so you got me on that
    one bud.

    Your kids will get used to it wont they? Why cant you explain what it
  19. yes im gonna get some flack for saying this but it is my belief that the incorporation of the Bible into the legal system was not intended to serve a religious purpose, remember it is not used in conjunction with prayer. Instead, I believe that the Bible is simply the best symbol identified to designate faith that can be found in our fellow man.

    Without the Bible, it would be necessary to find another symbol of personal integrity and ethical behavior to conduct the legal oath. The symbol is merely a physical reminder to each witness that their oath is important and involves penalties if broken. Since the Bible represents the concept of faith to so many people, it is a perfect symbol to represent the faith each witness is asking us to have in their testimony in a court of law.