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Beware this guy and his trailer

Discussion in 'Hazardous Road Condition Reports' started by Wolve, Feb 1, 2010.

  1. It's been a while but I finally found this guy today commuting from Croydon down the Eastern to Brunswick. A while ago when I had my Honda VT1100C2 I filtered past stationary traffic on the Maroondah Hwy heading West at the intersection of Mitcham Road pulling up behind a Semi as he was taking up the whole lane. I was in far left of the right lane sitting there when the lights changed and vehicles in the centre lane began moving but the Semi in front of me didn't.

    Suddenly I was being dragged along by the dual axle trailer you can see in this picture, the front corner having ripped a chunk from my calf and smashed my left leg forward, snapping the peg off and wrapping the gear lever around the front of the bike. Falling into the side of the trailer the tank of the bike sustained a huge dent with red grout embedded after contacting the fender and my left arm ended up with a massive bruise behind the elbow and my left wrist had something wrenched that took almost two years to come good. The Saddle bag was ripped and scratched before he finally stopped and I managed to straighten up before the bike fell over and I rolled on the ground.

    As two people from the truck behind me jumped down to help me pick the bike up this guy poked his head out of the car and muttered something like "F#$king motorbikes" and drove off without stopping. I was too shaken up and hurting to remember to take his rego but I have a very good memory for details and I never forget the face of assholes who try to kill me. So when I saw this guy today I recognized him immediately. He's a tradie with a tile cutting saw on the front of the trailer. I recalled the chrome mirrors and silver wheel arches of his Black Nissan Navara 4 door Ute, same as I put in the report I made to police on the day after I had xRays at Maroondah Hospital to check why my arm hurt so much.

    Question is, do I go back to the Police and see if they can did up my original report and inform then after all this time or forget it? The way I see it, this guy owes me $700 for the repairs to my bike and a knuckle sandwich for not stopping to see if I was alright after he hit me.
  2. It wouldnt hurt to try. Take him down a peg or two i say, that prick deserves it!!
  3. First I would suggest that if you want to keep the picture in your post you should edit out the license plate. I don't think it would look good if someone decided to engage in a little vigilante justice against this guy, and you should wait until his crime is proved guilty before ousting him directly (and an internet forum is not the correct place for that).

    Now to your question. In my view it will depend on a number of factors. How long ago are we talking? Weeks, months, years? Obviously the longer it's been the harder it will be to pursue (simple because of fading memories, evidence and interest). Do you have the contact details of any witnesses who would be able to identify the vehicle from an image? You want to avoid a your-word vs. his-word type situation if you want to go back to the police. What happened first time around? Were the police able to get anything, or did any witnesses provide any corroborating descriptions (which would match the vehicle you identified)?

    If it was a long time ago I personally doubt the police would be all that interested in the matter (after a long time there is little chance of any outcome, so from their view it is a waste of time, and realistically, probably a waste of yours if nothing comes of it). That said, we are dealing with some serious offences; hit and run situation, failing to render assistance, fleeing the scene of an accident, and so forth. When you consider some of the inane crap people constantly pester the police about at least this situation has serious circumstances.
  4. The answer is yes.
    Update the report.
    If the cops want to pursue it they, will, if they don’t want to they wont.
    There is nothing you can do except ensure that all of the details are there.
    Because he drove away from an incident in which someone was injured there are criminal charges that can be laid.
  5. You may want to elaborate on that, but I totally disagree.
  6. +1

    thanks I will now avoid this driver when I am anywhere near it.
  7. I am for the notion of letting the pic and the number plate stay.
    For good it warns the rest of us about him.
    As suggested by others already, I would also update the cops with the details, and then call the cops almost every alternate day asking about the progress against this guy....untill they decide to take some action.
  8. How about taking justice into your own hands ?? What the hell with the boys in blue do for you ??
  9. Go to the Cops, mate.
  10. Worth trying the cops, doubt they'd do much...

    Dunno how you kept yourself from pulling him out of his car right then and doing the exact same shit he did to you. I want to do it for you and I wasn't even there...

    (Not being 'internet tough guy', just can't stand people treating others like animals... anyone who flees the scene of an accident is utter scum)
  11. You are right, there is no direct requirement.

    In equity, there is a general maxim - 'one who comes to equity must do so with clean hands'. Now equity and criminal law are two very different beasts, and an improper action on the part of the victim of a crime will not prejudice justice. However, the basic concept remains a good idea regardless of what area of law is being dealt with.

    Me? No, for a start it is a bit of a trip from Brisbane, but honestly, I have no intention of assaulting someone because they have done harm. Can I say the same for everyone else who may read the forum post? No, I cannot, there is no way I can predict what response anyone else may have. For that matter, neither can you.

    Indeed, already we have....

    Now, in many respects these are perfectly understandable posts - after all, they are just expressing their reactions to what happened to Wolve (and as Donuts rightly points out, anyone who flees the scene of an accident is utter scum, which is why it is a criminal offence). But at this stage the owner of that trailer has not been found guilty of such an offence. Yet one person is suggesting that Wolve take justice into his own hands (ps. don't do that Wolve, you will end up in more trouble than the person who caught you with his trailer) and another stating that if they were in Wolve's position, they would have taken justice into their own hands.

    Granted these are likely idle threats, but they are still threats. And the law doesn't take to kindly to threats. Combine a threat with an identifiable target and you are well on your way to a criminal offence and a tort.

    (emphasis added)

    Now should the owner of that trailer stumble upon this thread they may well interpret some of the comments made as a threat of assault against they person. In reality, it does not appear that there is any intention on anyone’s part to actually commit an assault (which is an essential element here), but I doubt that will stop the owner from making a complaint. Without a way to directly identify the owner it is likely any such complaint would be dismissed much sooner and with much less hassle to those who made it.

    The tort of assault requires that a threat of physical assault (battery in torts terminology) be made which causes the plaintiff to reasonably apprehend that physical assault is forthcoming. There is no requirement of intention, but this is a civil 'wrong', not criminal (which means no criminal penalties like jail, but a significantly lighter burden of proof, merely on the balance of probabilities). Now a legal action for assault is unlikely to succeed on the basis that such actions rarely get up where there is no imminent means of the threat being carried out, but the internet is somewhat changing the playing field here (largely because the criminal versions of assault are much less flexible, so plaintiffs turn to civil course of justice where Judges can be a little more flexible in the face of changing means of communication).

    There is also defamation, which is a another can of worms again. But I hate defamation and don't feel like going into it (not that it is hard to work out anyway). Regardless of likelihood of success, defamation would be a royal pain to Wolve and possibly the owners of the site (sorry Jason and Vic). Remove the identifier and the problem pretty much goes away (you can't defame someone if there is no way to identify the target of the defamatory statement).

    Sorry, I must have missed where the registered owner of that particular trailer had been duly convicted of offences arising from what had happened to Wolve.

    Being an internet jury may be fun, but no, it is not the right place to find guilt. I have no reason to believe that Wolve's memory is incorrect, but ultimately his identification of this vehicle is evidence, and evidence may be disputed, cross-examined – that is an essential requirement of natural justice. It may be found that the evidence does not demonstrate guilt; it may be that the person driving was not the owner of the vehicle, it may be that the vehicle has since been sold. Actually, there are thousands of possibilities, but, once again, the internet is not the correct place to assess them.

    I encourage Wolve to seek justice for what happened. I provided advice drawn from my own personal and professional experience. It is up to him to decide what actions he wishes to take and by extension, the outcomes that arise. Wolve hasn't set out to do anything wrong or cause harm (as far as I can tell), he just wants an outcome that gives him justice for the wrong committed against him. But in criminal matters, and indeed, any legal matter, both parties have to step very lightly, or you will score an own-goal (often a good legal tactic is to sit back, play it safe and let the other guy implode - saves so much time and effort).

    Because it's on the internet it can't possibly give rise to any legal issues?
    Well, for a start, you only provide two Australian sites (though there is nothing stopping Australian's posting about Australian's on the US sites - and conversely, nothing stopping either the provider or publisher from being potentially liable - particularly for the torts of defamation and injurious falsehood). I had a quick look and it seems they are more interested in bad parking, forgetting to indicate and speeding. I don't see anything encouraging you report ongoing or potential criminal cases, nor any posts which cover such details (I am sure there have been some made, but that's not the purpose of these sites). Finally there are so many disclaimers against responsibility that I am sure a quick letter under a solicitor's letterhead would result in a very rapid retraction (and apology). Spurious at best.
  12. Sorry but if you still blindly follow the jury will find and punish the guilty always, you seriously need to wake up.
    If they did, the offender here have been long identified and convicted. And yes, am sure the authorities in here have enough resources to find out who is travelling where at what time in which reg. no vehicle.

    There are situations where you being the victim know no ones gonna do shit...thats when you take responsibilities.
    According to your LONG explanation, you would be a person, who, if is the only witness to a murder in a dark alley, he would say, ahh the long hands of law will get him, he isnt hurting me anyways, why should i bother?

    There is a sense beyond believing the "blind law", its part of being a human. Help that guy who is getting stabbed, try and knock the murderer off or help in any way possible to apprehend him.

    That guy was at wrong, was a moron for not stopping to help, even if he genuinely had nothing to do with the accident, and is rightly defamed.

    No I don't support taking the law into your own hands all the time, but then I would support the judgement power of a victim at the scene of an incident.
    If someone is killing my family, I won't sit and finish my coffee thinking the law is out there to get him....someday.
  13. How long ago did the accident happen? If it is more than 12 months, it may be outside of the statute of limitations, and they may not be able to do anything, but I would still go and see them anyway.
  14. By the way how did you take that pic? Did you have a cam on your helmet or while stopped did you quickly pull out the iPhone to snap him up?
  15. i work in insurance and just to let you know i doubt you will have any chance of anything comming to light now.

    firstly you didnt have the number plate of the guy last time and a year later saying "oh i saw a guy with the same colored car and trailer and im sure its the guy because i remember his face" will not get you anywhere. not trying to put a downer on your attempts, its just that police/ insurance will likely say after a year you cant be sure its the same guy and it might just be someone similar looking with similar car etc.

    more to this is that even if it is the same guy unless he admits it or you have a witness to prove this guy hit you (safe to assume you dont have one that can confirm rego details as you would have used this already), or if his car/ trailer show no damage or the tradie says the daamge is from something else liek say dropping his equipment on the area it is still at the end of the day your word against his.

    your likely right and it probbably is the same guy but telling your insurance or the police now will get you nowhere. yo should have smashed his window or something and got out of there when no one was looking as thats about the best justice you can hope for now i think.
  16. insurance limitations is 7 years to lodge a claim. dont know if there is one for criminal issues with this.
  17. I am talking criminal charges for traffic offences statute of limitations is 12 months.
  18. I have asked a friend of mine who is a cop and have been told there is no limitation regarding crime.. a crime is a crime and if the eveidence is there to prove it then it shall be used..

    for instance you do something wrong and go into hiding... do you come out 7 years later and laugh at the police saying you cant touch me as the statute has passed??? i dont think so as many people would do that..

    If your bike sustained damage by the trailer surely the person hasnt fixed the trailer so if you can match the damage from the trailer to the damage on your bike (if it hasnt been fixed) then there is your eveidence... for instance paint scrap.. could be matched to the paint on your bike and if you were badly hurt and took time off work you do have 7 years to make a civil claim for damages against a person for negligence and lost earnings..

    if the police do nothing about it might pay off to go see a solicitor..
  19. Get this thread deleted. Then go kill him! :)
  20. Maybe in Victoria, but there is a statute of limitation on many crimes in NSW. I can't remember what it is and whether is was based on misdemeanors or not, but certainly it was the case.

    I also remember someone had to die within a year and a day for murder to apply.

    Of course the OP is in Victoria and it is likely to be a traffic offence rather than a criminal offence, so anything may be the case.