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ARRB Research Report - Summary of the 3rd International Road Surface Friction Conference 2011

Discussion in 'Research, Studies, and Data' at netrider.net.au started by robsalvv, Jan 18, 2012.

  1. For those that are this way inclinded, the ARRB Research Report - Summary of the 3rd International Road Surface Friction Conference 2011, is an interesting and easy read - about road surfaces.

    There's even a section on motorcycle braking and they compare an FJR1300 with ABS to an FZ6 non ABS... it's far from a scientific comparison, but the FZ6 outbrakes the FJR in the dry at 50km/h. There's no mention of age or condition of the bikes and tyres or methodology. So take the results as you will.

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  2. I don't understand the use of 2 completely different bikes.
    Especially since they just jammed them together in one table
    as "Distance with ABS, distance without"

    For that to make any sense they should have used 2 of the same model - one with ABS and one without.
    It seems like they just grabbed 2 available bikes and went "Bugger it they're all basically the same anyway"
    Which seems like very sloppy data gathering.
  3. Yeah an fz6 would weigh a lot less than an fjr1300
  4. yep, sloppy is about right.
  5. My ex boss worked for ARRB. His logic on pretty much most things was always about as relevant and valid as the marital status of the number 5.
  6. ~190kg vs ~290kg. That's over a 50% difference.
    It makes no sense at all why they would use those 2 bikes as comparators.
  7. I think the point is that a VTR250 is a good bike for a learner :-s

    There is no reason you guys couldn't put together a paper on a whole heap of bikes with two or three trusted riders on Saturday practice. Photos of all of the tires, triplicate runs from each rider on one bike (with randomized sequence) to control for rider ability and then just a single run on every bike that turns up (an un-measured practice first). Pressures set as recommended.

    Once you get the data together a student (4th year mech eng) could write it up for their thesis and get a good paper out of it.

    As I don't actually go to these things I'm not going to run it but if anybody wants to do the organizing (start a thread) I can help with the experimental design. I could get a student up here (well, put it on the list with the lectures, but who isn't going to take the thesis that already has the data collected and is about bikes), but a local would be better.
  8. That would be bloody interesting.

    Do ya think that riders would have to swap bikes to eliminate "home braking" advantage?
  9. That seems to be about the standard of most road use researchers. Yes, I'm thinking MUARC.
  10. Given the difference between what an engineer can earn in the public or quasi-public sectors vs what they can earn in the private sector these days, I find it unsurprising that the former get the dregs and the zealots.

    I effectively doubled my salary overnight when I quit working for the government and I have to deal with a lot fewer f'wits on either side of the counter. Who wouldn't go for it unless they had either a personal agenda or no choice?
  11. Yes. You'd have, say, three trusted riders (ones that people would be happy to lend their bike to for 5 minutes) and their performance would be the basis of comparison between bikes. However you might as well record everyone's attempt as a spirit of competition for e-braking is not a bad thing to foster either.

    In reality, by getting some data together and sending it to a uni along with some contact names then you will almost certainly get an engineer to do an undergraduate thesis on it (getting the data is always the hard bit). Once you have a thesis and some data you have a platform to talk to policy wonks about random stuff. Possibly my normal agenda about how all big business and government employees should throw themselves off cliffs might be a bit to random, but you could talk about bike stuff!

    e-braking is an easy thing to test because it is a bike performance category rather than a safety systems thing. I can't see any negatives (except for maybe a dropped bike or two, at low speed, off the road).

    It is important to record distance, time for the 20m before the brake point, tire pressure, tread depth, bike make, rider weight, rider age, rider experience. The three chosen riders should do three runs on a standard bike (say a VTR250) and then it doesn't matter which rider tests each bike.